Religion and Ethics Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Sriram on April 15, 2017, 05:22:06 AM
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Hi everyone,
Here are some vegetarian recipes for Easter...from BBC.
https://www.bbcgoodfood.com/howto/guide/vegetarian-easter-menu
Let the animals have a Happy Easter too!
Cheers.
Sriram
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::)
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Recipes look delicious sririam! Bit late for me to start planning Easter menus now. Salmon & spinach fishcakes last night, have large gammon joint in oven right now & lamb for tomorrow or Monday,depending what we're doing. I do cook veggie sometimes though.
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::)
Why??? Love and compassion, ad_orientem! Jesus said that remember?!
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The evidence shows that we humans are related to 'all' life forms, if you trace our history bsck far enough, so I suppose technically it's difficult to avoid eating our relatives.
ippy
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I've often considered being a vegetarian, would be if I was on my own (I think).
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I've often considered being a vegetarian, would be if I was on my own (I think).
Hi Robbie,
Vegetarian is the way to go. I am sure 50 years from today there will be many more vegetarians world wide than now.
You don't have to become a complete vegetarian all at once. First restrict the types of meat you eat and the number of times a day. Then slowly cut it down further.
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Never eat meat more than once a day and often not at all, like vegetables & salad. This long weekend is an exception. A good vegeetarian diet is very healthy, what worries me is not being bothered to do it properly. I don't eat a lot as it is. I'll think about it next week.
I am sure 50 years from today there will be many more vegetarians world wide than now.
You're right about that, I'm sure. There are more vegetarians now than ever, they're well catered for in restaurants & supermarkets. When I was a child vegetarians were considered difficult & odd!
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I expect that - in much less than 50 years time - the opposition to genetically modified organisms will have virtually disappeared and also that artificially produced meat which is indistinguishable from the natural product will be available. No doubt there will still be a demand for animal-sourced products but the protein requirement will be more readily met from vegetable resources. There will be a much smaller need to use cows (pigs, sheep etc) as the medium by which vegetation is transformed into human food. Please note - I am a carnivore (more accurately, omnivore)
One of the things which I always note when travelling across France is the huge area devoted to the production of animal feed compared with the small area actually used for stock farming. In a more rational system much of this land would devoted to crops which are consumed directly by people.
I was in the presence of a vegan a few weeks ago who went to great lengths to ensure he consumed no dairy products. It made me wonder whether or not devout vegan mothers breast feed their babies. Breat milk is an animal product.
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Never eat meat more than once a day and often not at all, like vegetables & salad. This long weekend is an exception. A good vegeetarian diet is very healthy, what worries me is not being bothered to do it properly. I don't eat a lot as it is. I'll think about it next week.
I am sure 50 years from today there will be many more vegetarians world wide than now.
You're right about that, I'm sure. There are more vegetarians now than ever, they're well catered for in restaurants & supermarkets. When I was a child vegetarians were considered difficult & odd!
Yeah. We (my parents, sister and I) traveled through Europe in 1971. The only vegetarian food we ever got was orange juice, bread butter and French fries (I bet they were fried in animal fat). London was an exception where we found an Indian restaurant (run by Pakistani students funnily). Oddly we also managed to get good Indian veg pulao and subji in one restaurant in Zurich. Everywhere else they didn't even understand what we meant by vegetarian.
Now it is different. We went on a Europe tour last year and it was pure vegetarian Indian meals twice a day, all through Europe!!! Great!
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I found the best way of going veggie is to cut out red meat, then chicken, and then fish. Going cold turkey (excuse the pun) doesn't work unless you already eat very little meat. Also think about how you will replace the meat. I use s lot of canned pulses in bolognese sauces and ragu.
For a Sunday roast I recommend Camembert in breadcrumbs (goes well with cranberry for Xmas) or a veggie pie.
Just to note, I don't care if other people eat meat or not.
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Neither do I! I've always liked roast lamb and lamb chops, hence the meat I have for tomorrow or Tuesday, but have liked it less recently.\
Chicken features frequntly in family meals.
Seriously thinking of going veggie.
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I have never liked lamb very much, we had it every Sunday lunchtime when I was a kid as it was my Father's favourite.
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Non veg Foods have a gradation..
Fish, Chicken, Lamb, beef, pork, sea food...prawns, lobsters etc....then the exotic foods...shark fin, octopus, ostrich neck, monkey brain...insects, lizards, cockroaches etc.
The idea is to move left.
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Shell fish and crustaceans a definite no-no for me! My parents (& others later), tried to persuade me how 'nice' such things were but I couldn't face even the thought of them. Apart from the cruelty involved (who says a lobster doesn't feel pain?), just didn't fancy them.
I'd put pork before beef, pork is considered a 'white' meat here. Beef difficult to digest.
My gammon joint looks good! Doubt I'll eat much of it tho'. It's big enough to last a week, I bought one too big so may put the lamb to one side, it's vacuum packed and eat by25th.
Lamb was always my favourite meat but recently I've enjoyed it less especially served with a selection of vegetables for some reason. The TV chefs often say, "Too much going on on the plate" and I understand what they mean now.
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It's not very likely.
Have just caught 4 trout fly fishing.
🎣
Later on in the year I start catching Mackrel from the shore, last year two of us caught 60 which we shared.
I'm still eating those :)
Sometimes we go out deep sea fishing on a boat and last year caught some Pollack. 🚣
Fish is good for you.
I have Duck for tea, with plum sauce 🙂 Which I will prepare once I've recovered from the fly fishing.
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Why??? Love and compassion, ad_orientem! Jesus said that remember?!
Jesus ate the Passover lamb.
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If God did other want us to eat animals, why did he make them out of meat?
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People are made out of meat.
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People are made out of meat.
People are sometimes eaten as well.
I would eat people if I was hungry enough and you probably would too.
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People are sometimes eaten as well.
I would eat people if I was hungry enough and you probably would too.
I don't think Sriram will approve.
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"People who eat people are the luckiest people in the world", if I remember the song correctly.
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I don't think Sriram will approve.
Perhaps he would too if hungry enough!
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People are sometimes eaten as well.
I would eat people if I was hungry enough and you probably would too.
BeRational,
That is true only if ones animal instincts are very strong. The whole point of spirituality is to control and reduce them.
People have starved and not eaten meat, let along human flesh. Some people would rather starve than even steal food and eat, for that matter. So, what you say does not apply to everyone.
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Jesus ate the Passover lamb.
so he took a narrow reading of 'Thou shalt not kill'
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Hi Robbie,
Vegetarian is the way to go. I am sure 50 years from today there will be many more vegetarians world wide than now.
You don't have to become a complete vegetarian all at once. First restrict the types of meat you eat and the number of times a day. Then slowly cut it down further.
50 years from now, maybe all the meat on the meat counters will be lab-grown. Would you eat that ?
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50 years from now, maybe all the meat on the meat counters will be lab-grown. Would you eat that ?
I have lived my entire life (very satisfactorily) eating rice, wheat, pulses and veggies. Why would I eat some lab grown 'meat'....whatever that is?!
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50 years from now, maybe all the meat on the meat counters will be lab-grown. Would you eat that ?
What a huge impact that would have on the world we live in.
No more sheep or cows, in the countryside grazing. You would lose so many places which only look like they do because of the grazing of sheep.
Exmoor all those places only look like they do because they have been grazed by sheep for hundreds of years. All that would go if the meat industry went, it would be a different looking country.
A lot of militant vegans seem to forget it's farmers who keep and look after these animals and lots of them are not really wild but get fed, which costs money.
Plus the farmer goes out and finds them in snowy weather, gets a vet if his animal has trouble giving birth. No one else gets out of bed in the night in snow to make sure the sheep are ok.
Doing away with meat wouldn't just mean these animals would disappear from the countryside, but that our countryside would change, other animals wildlife would lose their habitat.
For some reason militant vegans seem to think farmers will keep these animals as pets, they won't. It costs time & money. ( I've had this argument with animal rights people before, they naively think the farmer is going to carry on keeping these animals, or that they can be turned loose, most have no idea how much care they actually require)
Most of our wild scenery would change, we would have a different kind of landscape.
For example, Exmoor is only Exmoor because it has been grazed over hundreds of years by sheep. Same in Wales, except in some places people complain it's over grazed by sheep.
Having grown meat has its positives, but it will also impact our ecosystem, our wildlife, our countryside.
Picture this , replace every field of cows and sheep and their spring lambs, with fields of yellow rape seed, field on field of purely crops, all the same.
Crops are sterile environments for wildlife, deserts of often inedible plants.
Is this what people want?
No more spring lambs frolicking in the sun?
No more moorland?
It might not impact the scenery in India, but it will ours.
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That is delightfully pastoral, Rose, but it is rather painting the same picture of bucolic theme park England that the Bexiteers love. Nostalgia isn't what it used to be!
Modern stock farming does not take place on heathland and moorland. It is becoming intensive. Read my comments in #8 about the landscape of France. Miles upon miles of maize being grown for cattle feed with very much few cattle actually being seen.
You are correct about the evolution of our landscape - but I think that commercial pressures are removing animals from areas where they ranged widely to places where costs can be better managed.
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Vegetarianism and veganism are just fads. Most who abstain from meat and animal products are just holier than thou wankers who love the smell of their own farts. Until hell freezes over I'm eating meat.
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Vegetarianism and veganism are just fads. Most who abstain from meat and animal products are just holier than thou wankers who love the smell of their own farts. Until hell freezes over I'm eating meat.
You really are an utter dipstick sometimes.
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That is delightfully pastoral, Rose, but it is rather painting the same picture of bucolic theme park England that the Bexiteers love. Nostalgia isn't what it used to be!
Modern stock farming does not take place on heathland and moorland. It is becoming intensive. Read my comments in #8 about the landscape of France. Miles upon miles of maize being grown for cattle feed with very much few cattle actually being seen.
You are correct about the evolution of our landscape - but I think that commercial pressures are removing animals from areas where they ranged widely to places where costs can be better managed.
Yes, I agree, I don't think vegetarianism/veganism would have the appeal that it does were this not the case.
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Farming is kinder here than it used to be, there is far more concentration on animal welfare and that means emotional welfare as well as physical health.We see cattle grazing, pigs rooting and lambs in fields everywhere in the British countryside and hens are no longer battery farmed. I never buy any imported meat (inc.Danish bacon), poultry or eggs and use organic milk.Read all the blurb on packaging about the seller's commitment to animal welfare. I'm not giving myself a pat on the back,just stating facts, have always believed animals should be respected, they serve us after all. Most people I know do the same and thankfully such goods are not as expensive as a few years back.
It's not a perfect system and undoubtedly there are still abuses but we're getting there. Friends from the USA tell me animal welfare is not considered at all there and it's bad in other countries.
Yet I still eat animals :(.
No I wouldn't eat lab produced meaet, there's plenty of fruit and veg.
Ad-orient. what you said is ridiculous& put quite bluntly,vegetarianism is not a fad. It's a healthy diet.
I find vegans a bit too evangelical about their beliefs, vegetarians take it as far as they can.
Having eaten me roast gammon yesterday(& have plenty left in the fridge, may give it all up from today on). Two extra large F/R boiled eggs fro breakast today, unfortunately cooked them too long so were hard. I've tons of fruit and veg so am going to give it a whirl.
Wish me luck.
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Whilst a vegetarian lifestyle can be reasonably healthy, I don't think a vegan one is, especially if it is inflicted on children.
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You really are an utter dipstick sometimes.
I think you are sometimes too but on this point I'm spot on, pal. They're fads, like lactose and gluten free products. Mosr just jump on the band wagon and feel smug about themselves.
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No you're not ad-orientam. Vegetarianism is healthy if we eat sufficient variety of fruit & veg, better than clogging up digestive system & arteries.
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There is nothing wrong with eating meat. Be a vegetarian or a veagan but don't pretend to be morally superior because you ain't.
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I think you are sometimes too but on this point I'm spot on, pal. They're fads, like lactose and gluten free products. Mosr just jump on the band wagon and feel smug about themselves.
No, people with gluten and dairy allergies need free-from products or risk serious illness. Just because they are fashionable now doesn't mean that the products themselves are a fad.
As for vegetarianism and veganism, it's a matter of principle for many, preference for some, but not a fad, although it may have been once when it was new over here and I guess some teenagers might use it to annoy their parents. I certainly don't feel smug because I still eat dairy and wear leather.
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There is nothing wrong with eating meat. Be a vegetarian or a veagan but don't pretend to be morally superior because you ain't.
Did I say there was anything wrong with eating meat? Go back and read my posts.
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There is nothing wrong with eating meat. Be a vegetarian or a veagan but don't pretend to be morally superior because you ain't.
Except there are those vegetarians and vegans who do think it is morally wrong, and since you make an absolute statement from your personal morality, you justify them feeling superior subjectively.
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I think you are sometimes too but on this point I'm spot on, pal. They're fads, like lactose and gluten free products. Mosr just jump on the band wagon and feel smug about themselves.
I agree.
Why do vegetarians want to make some animals Extinct.
If currently eaten animals are not eaten then they would all be exterminated. Where would they live?
These animals are not wild, plus we would not have the space for them as the farms instead grow other stuff in their place.
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I agree.
Why do vegetarians want to make some animals Extinct.
If currently eaten animals are not eaten then they would all be exterminated. Where would they live?
These animals are not wild, plus we would not have the space for them as the farms instead grow other stuff in their place.
From my pov I accept that vegetarianism will always be a minority diet, although most people would benefit from eating a diet that is partially vegetarian. It's also more sustainable in terms of animal welfare and land and water usage for people to eat less meat and dairy.
Those who would have us all go veggie/vegan hold the view that livestock suffer so much that they would be better off not existing. I think that this is true of intensively farmed meat and dairy but not true of traditionally reared free ranging animals.
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Ad-o vegetarianism (& veganism), may be a fad for some but that can't be true of Hindus for example and not true for many who find the diet healthy. As long as no-one preaches about it I fail to see a problem & i don't like people who act morally superior about things like that.
Regarding wheat and gluten free diets they are marvellous for people with severe digestive problems like coeliac, IBs and others. It may be' fashionable' at the moment but the upside to that is more variety and cheaper wheat and gluten free food & is healthy too.
Nothing wrong with eating meat tho', just better for our bodies to limit meat intake.
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Please don't get me wrong. I would happily eat leass meat and spend more on it if I knew more about how it was farmed etc. As humans I just don't think we csn moralise about diet. Even eating vegetables is the taking of life, albeit vegetable life.
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Please don't get me wrong. I would happily eat leass meat and spend more on it if I knew more about how it was farmed etc. As humans I just don't think we csn moralise about diet. Even eating vegetables is the taking of life, albeit vegetable life.
Saying that eating animals is right, is moralising. Would it be on for you to eat dog? How about human?
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Saying that eating animals is right, is moralising. Would it be on for you to eat dog? How about human?
I said there is nothing wrong in it. A subtle difference.
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I said there is nothing wrong in it. A subtle difference.
Too subtle not to be moralising.
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Too subtle not to be moralising.
Not too subtle at all, except for the dim.
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Not too subtle at all, except for the dim.
deciding enter something is not wrong, and thinking you are correct, is moralising
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Saying that eating animals is right, is moralising. Would it be on for you to eat dog? How about human?
Saying about being vegetarian is moralising.
People are entitled to say eating meat is right If others start moralising about just eating vegetables.
It's hypocritical to accuse meat eaters of moralising, given the subject of this thread is moralising on the behalf of vegetarians.
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deciding enter something is not wrong, and thinking you are correct, is moralising
Pot kettle black
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Saying about being vegetarian is moralising.
People are entitled to say eating meat is right If others start moralising about just eating vegetables.
It's hypocritical to accuse meat eaters of moralising, given the subject of this thread is moralising on the behalf of vegetarians.
So vegetarians are doing something 'bad' in your view by expressing their opinion, that meat eaters are not by expressing their's? How does that work? And how does thinking that both might be moralising make someone hypocritical?
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Vegetarianism is not a fad - it's been around for centuries.
I have no strong feelings either way (Lamb in the oven as we speak - but a vegetarian pasta dish last night) - howeverm to declare it a fad is to fly in the face of evidence and truth, Ad-O.
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So vegetarians are doing something 'bad' in your view by expressing their opinion, that meat eaters are not by expressing their's? How does that work? And how does thinking that both might be moralising make someone hypocritical?
They are when the are criticising meat eaters by trying to make them feel guilty, which is what happens after Srirams initial post, people are made to feel guilty ( hence all the " I could be a vegetarian etc" ) then Sriram came back with a post on what Jesus would do etc.
Hypocritical comes in when the meat eaters are described as moralising just because they don't choose to be vegetarian and respond in kind.
That's how it works.
When the guilt trip doesn't work, meat eaters are then accused of moralising.
It isn't the meat eaters who brought the subject up.
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They are when the are criticising meat eaters by trying to make them feel guilty, which is what happens after Srirams initial post, people are made to feel guilty ( hence all the " I could be a vegetarian etc" ) then Sriram came back with a post on what Jesus would do etc.
Hypocritical comes in when the meat eaters are described as moralising just because they don't choose to be vegetarian and respond in kind.
That's how it works.
When the guilt trip doesn't work, meat eaters are then accused of moralising.
It isn't the meat eaters who brought the subject up.
So if anyone states a moral stance before anyone else, then they are moralising and bad? And any reply from anyone who tells then they are wrong isn't? That sort of buggers any form of meaningful moral discourse.
By the way, I didn't make any generalisation that meat eaters are moralising, just that ad_o was. So your accusation of hypocrisy is based on a misrepresentation. And, I did n't say that vegetarians were not moralistic ng, so I still fail to see what hypocrisy you meant.
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So if anyone states a moral stance before anyone else, then they are moralising and bad? And any reply from anyone who tells then they are wrong isn't? That sort of buggers any form of meaningful moral discourse.
By the wat, I didn't make any generalisation that meat eaters are moralising, just that ad_o was. So your accusation of hypocrisy is based on a misrepresentation.
Yes, if anyone takes a moral stance on something and presents it as a criticism of others and that their way is superior, they are moralising.
Especially on controversial subjects that others feel they are fed up with, due to it being the same old tired subject of how in an ideal world they should be different
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Yes, if anyone takes a moral stance on something and presents it as a criticism of others and that their way is superior, they are moralising.
Especially on controversial subjects that others feel they are fed up with, due to it being the same old tired subject of how in an ideal world they should be different
I think rape is bad, I think my morality is superior to rapists and I think they are bad.
So if a rapist disagrees with that , you according to this thread think, I was somehow doing something you see as 'bad' and the rapist would not if they said I was wring for thinking rape was bad.
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I think rape is bad, I think my morality is superior to rapists and I think they are bad.
So if a rapist disagrees with that , you according to this thread think, I was somehow doing something you see as 'bad' and the rapist would not if they said I was wring for thinking rape was bad.
We are not discussing rapists though, thinking rapists are bad, is not a controversial idea.
Whereas thinking that eating meat is morally a bad thing, is.
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We are not discussing rapists though, thinking rapists are bad, is not a controversial idea.
Whereas thinking that eating meat is morally a bad thing, is.
No, we were discussing you logic that whoever starts a discussion saying some action is wrong they are doing something 'bad" in your view. It didn't used to be controversial in this country to own slaves, was William Wilberforce just moralising?
To
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Everything is so black & white to you NEarlySane!
Life has lots of grey areas.
Rose objects to veggies being evangelical about it, and acting superior. I've not enocountered that, only with vegans, but Rose might have.
No-one here is objecting to meat eaters, even sririam accepts thaat we in west are generally carivores.
We're discussing the health benefits as well as ethics. Rose is right that fish is good food value. It's up to each of us to decide what is right for us as individuals.
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I think you are sometimes too but on this point I'm spot on, pal. They're fads, like lactose and gluten free products. Mosr just jump on the band wagon and feel smug about themselves.
People need lactose and gluten free, not because they are fads but because without them they suffer a lot of stomach pain.
It's like peanuts, to some people, they are lethal.
Some types of foods have adverse reactions on some people, they are not " making a fuss"
I've known caterers just think peanut allergy is a fad, but it isn't, you can kill someone.
What you " choose" to eat can be a fad, but people who are allergic to peanuts, gluten or lactose have body that reacts adversely to something.
You can be allergic to just about anything, one friend of mine is so allergic to blue cheese her throat swells up and she has to be rushed off to hospital for an injection.
I'd never assume someone else's eating habits was just a fad, because it might not be.
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Everything is so black & white to you NEarlySane!
Life has lots of grey areas.
Rose objects to veggies being evangelical about it, and acting superior. I've not enocountered that, only with vegans, but Rose might have.
No-one here is objecting to meat eaters, even sririam accepts thaat we in west are generally carivores.
We're discussing the health benefits as well as ethics. Rose is right that fish is good food value. It's up to each of us to decide what is right for us as individuals.
In what way do you think that some on both sides might be moralising is seeing things in black and white, as opposed to vegetarians are moralising?
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Who here is being 'made to feel guilty'? And if someone is happy and secure in their moral choices then that is never an issue anyway.
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Vegetarianism and veganism are just fads. Most who abstain from meat and animal products are just holier than thou wankers who love the smell of their own farts. Until hell freezes over I'm eating meat.
Have you never been to India ?
You really ought to get out about bit more, and grow
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I have lived my entire life (very satisfactorily) eating rice, wheat, pulses and veggies. Why would I eat some lab grown 'meat'....whatever that is?!
Humans evolved as omnivores, it might be that your digestive system is optimised for a diet that includes some flesh and you are denying it. Also, you might find it tastes nice. Lab grown meat would bypass the ethical problems of killing sentient animals who don't want to be eaten and cannot fight back against us,
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People need lactose and gluten free, not because they are fads but because without them they suffer a lot of stomach pain.
It's like peanuts, to some people, they are lethal.
Some types of foods have adverse reactions on some people, they are not " making a fuss"
I've known caterers just think peanut allergy is a fad, but it isn't, you can kill someone.
What you " choose" to eat can be a fad, but people who are allergic to peanuts, gluten or lactose have body that reacts adversely to something.
You can be allergic to just about anything, one friend of mine is so allergic to blue cheese her throat swells up and she has to be rushed off to hospital for an injection.
I'd never assume someone else's eating habits was just a fad, because it might not be.
But most who claim to be lactose or gluten intolerant actually aren't, they've just jumped onto the bandwagon convincing themselves that they are. Because of that it's almost like you can only get lactose free milk products but they're rank. Lactose intolerant then don't consume dairy. Simple.
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But most who claim to be lactose or gluten intolerant actually aren't, they've just jumped onto the bandwagon convincing themselves that they are. Because of that it's almost like you can only get lactose free milk products but they're rank. Lactose intolerant then don't consume dairy. Simple.
Why shouldn't someone with an allergy or intolerance not be able to buy alternatives?
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Quite agree Rhiannon.
Ad-o, how do you know that people jump on the bandwagon? Maybe they've tried different diets and eventually found what suits and what doesn't suit them. Children,even babies, can go through horrors until they are diagnosed & its often parents who find out through trial and error.We should not be too quick to judge others.
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I've nothing against alternatives. It's when the alternatives become the norm which irks me. Dairy is meant to have lactose in it. I want my dairy with lactose in it, but because of a few now nearly everything is lactose free which tastes rank. Same goes for gluten free. Try and buy cheese over here that isn't lactose free.
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My granddad was a widower when he met my nan. As well as his wife he'd lost a baby girl to 'malnutrition'. The baby was a huge secret - the stigma of having a baby die of that was awful and I think it was maybe what killed his first wife. Now of course we know it was almost certainly some kind of milk allergy that made the baby malnourished, and back in those days (early 30's, in a poor area) they would have just tried to keep fattening her up. I guess another possibility would have been some kind of gut malformation that these days would be treatable with surgery but the result then would have been the same. It breaks my heart to think of her.
As an aside I found out her name a while ago and had a tree planted for her so she's not forgotten.
Thank goodness we have alternatives now. My daughter needed lactose free milk but outgrew her intolerance by about six months of age. Before that she was in so much pain.
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That is a very sad story Rhiannon.
I've nothing against alternatives. It's when the alternatives become the norm which irks me. Dairy is meant to have lactose in it. I want my dairy with lactose in it, but because of a few now nearly everything is lactose free which tastes rank. Same goes for gluten free. Try and buy cheese over here that isn't lactose free.
I'm surprised ad-orientem. Here most stuff isn't lactose free, there is just some sold on special stands in supermarkets alongside wheat & G/F. Everything else is normal dairy & wide variety of cheeses.
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I suppose - sort of in defence of Ad-O - there are people who misrepresent their relationship with gluten or lactose ...
I have a friend who is gluten intolerant and has coeliac disease. This means that she has difficulty in leading what, to the rest of us, is a normal life. We visit restaurants and find that staff, with the best of intentions, sometimes do not really understand the nature of the condition. She sometimes has to leave because the restaurant cannot accommodate her requirements, which are due to a malfunction in her autoimmune system.
I have another friend who will not eat products containing gluten ... because they contain gluten. She has no pathological condition which makes this necessary, she is simply convinced that gluten is bad because there are people who are gluten intolerant. Therefore she refuses to eat anything containing gluten. This is a fad and no rational discussion can make her change her mind.
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Hi everyone,
The issue of morality does arise in vegetarianism....especially when we consider animal rights. Britishers may consider eating dogs as wrong....but beef is ok. In India even non vegetarian Hindus will not eat beef because killing cows is considered wrong.
Many confirmed non vegetarians will not themselves kill cows or sheep or chicken for their meal. They would happily pick it up from the supermarket but will not be associated with any killing. I am sure many people will give up meat if they visit a slaughter house. Many children would react very dramatically to killing of any animal that they have played with earlier. They may refuse to eat that meat. I am sure many of you would cringe at the idea of eating monkey brain cooked with boiling oil while the animal is still alive.
So...there is a moral issue involved with killing of animals. However, people have been eating meat for millennia and so it is a natural part of human diet in most parts of the world. So...it cannot really be considered immoral also. This is a dilemma.
The point is that morality does not remain constant through long periods of time and is not the same in every part of the world. It is relative. Morality changes. And we should be willing to accept this change....and not stick to a lifestyle merely because of some ancient religious text. Morality is what we feel today, not what someone did thousands of years ago.
If large sections of society today consider it wrong to eat animals, then that is today's morality in that society. We should be able to go along with that. We don't have to necessarily hold on to our habits and lifestyle.
Cheers.
Sriram
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The point is that morality does not remain constant through long periods of time and is not the same in every part of the world. It is relative. Morality changes. And we should be willing to accept this change....and not stick to a lifestyle merely because of some ancient religious text. Morality is what we feel today, not what someone did thousands of years ago.
Hear hear ;)
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Check this out....
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/germany-meat-ban-environment-ministry_us_58ae1b24e4b01406012f962b
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Animal agriculture is a leading cause of climate change and environmental degradation, which is why a German ministry says it’s taking a stand for vegetarianism in a new — and controversial — ban.
Barbara Hendricks, Germany’s environment minister, announced that her ministry would no longer be serving meat, fish or meat-derived products at official functions. Hendricks said her ministry must serve as a “role model” on environmental and sustainability issues.
“We want to set a good example for climate protection, because vegetarian food is more climate-friendly than meat and fish,” the ministry said in a statement this week, according to The Daily Telegraph. The ban reportedly took effect at the end of January.
The ministry mandate also states that meals served at official functions should be organically sourced, with a preference for seasonal, local and fair-trade products, reported German newspaper Bild. Ingredients should only be transported a short distance, the mandate said.
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Not bad at all, I must say.
'There is nothing more powerful than an idea whose time has come'.....
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Hi everyone,
The issue of morality does arise in vegetarianism....especially when we consider animal rights. Britishers may consider eating dogs as wrong....but beef is ok. In India even non vegetarian Hindus will not eat beef because killing cows is considered wrong.
Many confirmed non vegetarians will not themselves kill cows or sheep or chicken for their meal. They would happily pick it up from the supermarket but will not be associated with any killing. I am sure many people will give up meat if they visit a slaughter house. Many children would react very dramatically to killing of any animal that they have played with earlier. They may refuse to eat that meat. I am sure many of you would cringe at the idea of eating monkey brain cooked with boiling oil while the animal is still alive.
So...there is a moral issue involved with killing of animals. However, people have been eating meat for millennia and so it is a natural part of human diet in most parts of the world. So...it cannot really be considered immoral also. This is a dilemma.
The point is that morality does not remain constant through long periods of time and is not the same in every part of the world. It is relative. Morality changes. And we should be willing to accept this change....and not stick to a lifestyle merely because of some ancient religious text. Morality is what we feel today, not what someone did thousands of years ago.
If large sections of society today consider it wrong to eat animals, then that is today's morality in that society. We should be able to go along with that. We don't have to necessarily hold on to our habits and lifestyle.
Cheers.
Sriram
Ok
So the majority of the world eats meat sees nothing wrong in it ( even beef) , are you going to change your morality? Or is that only something others should do?
Can you change? Or again is that only for others to do?
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Hi everyone,
The issue of morality does arise in vegetarianism....especially when we consider animal rights. Britishers may consider eating dogs as wrong....but beef is ok. In India even non vegetarian Hindus will not eat beef because killing cows is considered wrong.
Where do Indians get their cricket balls from?
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Check this out....
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/germany-meat-ban-environment-ministry_us_58ae1b24e4b01406012f962b
************
Animal agriculture is a leading cause of climate change and environmental degradation, which is why a German ministry says it’s taking a stand for vegetarianism in a new — and controversial — ban.
Barbara Hendricks, Germany’s environment minister, announced that her ministry would no longer be serving meat, fish or meat-derived products at official functions. Hendricks said her ministry must serve as a “role model” on environmental and sustainability issues.
“We want to set a good example for climate protection, because vegetarian food is more climate-friendly than meat and fish,” the ministry said in a statement this week, according to The Daily Telegraph. The ban reportedly took effect at the end of January.
The ministry mandate also states that meals served at official functions should be organically sourced, with a preference for seasonal, local and fair-trade products, reported German newspaper Bild. Ingredients should only be transported a short distance, the mandate said.
************
Not bad at all, I must say.
'There is nothing more powerful than an idea whose time has come'.....
This is exactly the sort of thing that vexes me.
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This is exactly the sort of thing that vexes me.
But this is about the sustainability of eating meat, not the morality of eating other living creatures.
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I don't see why that would vex anyone it makes sense! If there was far less consumption of meat but not doing away with it altogether, there's be a considerable difference.
Following on from what someone said about manufactured meat-type products, today I read an article about laboratory-made meat, specifically hamburger type meat like beef & how it was tested on various people who thought it was beef. Bill Gates had something to do with the manufacture. Chicken &pork type stuff can also be made but they concentrated of beef substitute because minced beef is so widely used. Apparently the people who sampled it couldn't tell the difference but producing it is quite a lengthy difficult procedure. They put plant fluid in to mimic blood :o.
I'd have to taste it to know for sure and not sure I'd trust the manufacturing methods - who knows what chemicals would go into it - interesting though.
No need for that, I'm going to try making a spicy beanburger containing no meat - or bread - but lots of good veggies like onion, chili, tomatoes & spinach & two types of beans. (if I could buy one ready made it would be preferable due to lazyness).
Maybe it's already been asked but if we all became vegetarians which is not likely but possible, what would happen to all the animals? I understand that if demand for meat lessens, so will the need for breeding farm animals.
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I don't see why that would vex anyone it makes sense! If there was far less consumption of meat but not doing away with it altogether, there's be a considerable difference.
Following on from what someone said about manufactured meat-type products, today I read an article about laboratory-made meat, specifically hamburger type meat like beef & how it was tested on various people who thought it was beef. Bill Gates had something to do with the manufacture. Chicken &pork type stuff can also be made but they concentrated of beef substitute because minced beef is so widely used. Apparently the people who sampled it couldn't tell the difference but producing it is quite a lengthy difficult procedure. They put plant fluid in to mimic blood :o.
I'd have to taste it to know for sure and not sure I'd trust the manufacturing methods - who knows what chemicals would go into it - interesting though.
No need for that, I'm going to try making a spicy beanburger containing no meat - or bread - but lots of good veggies like onion, chili, tomatoes & spinach & two types of beans. (if I could buy one ready made it would be preferable due to lazyness).
Maybe it's already been asked but if we all became vegetarians which is not likely but possible, what would happen to all the animals? I understand that if demand for meat lessens, so will the need for breeding farm animals.
Bean burgers or veggie burgers are available in MacDonalds and Burger King in the UK. I have had them myself. In India both of them have many veggie options, one being a spicy paneer burger and wrap, crispy and tasty. Mac, Subway, Pizza Hut and others have some only veggie outlets in India.
Just google for some veggie recipe options. There are plenty on the net.
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Why not be an omnivore for easter instead?
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Bean burgers or veggie burgers are available in MacDonalds and Burger King in the UK. I have had them myself.
Indeed they are but they taste rubbish compared to meat burgers.
In India both of them have many veggie options, one being a spicy paneer burger and wrap, crispy and tasty. Mac, Subway, Pizza Hut and others have some only veggie outlets in India.
Just google for some veggie recipe options. There are plenty on the net.
The problem is that meat tastes nice. It's also easier to get a balanced nutritious diet if you eat some meat.
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Bean burgers or veggie burgers are available in MacDonalds and Burger King in the UK. I have had them myself. In India both of them have many veggie options, one being a spicy paneer burger and wrap, crispy and tasty. Mac, Subway, Pizza Hut and others have some only veggie outlets in India.
Just google for some veggie recipe options. There are plenty on the net.
I did and some look good! I know about McDonalds and Burger King but wanted something a bit less bready. Morrisons sell them frozen but would ideally like to try to make my own even though I'm not usually much of a one for burgers. I wouldn't serve with bread roll but with salad & maybe new potatoes.
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Indeed they are but they taste rubbish compared to meat burgers.
The problem is that meat tastes nice. It's also easier to get a balanced nutritious diet if you eat some meat.
Taste is cultivated and depends on our background. If I even so much as smell any meat cooking or even an omelette for that matter...I could throw up.
If human flesh tasted good would you eat it?
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Taste is cultivated and depends on our background. If I even so much as smell any meat cooking or even an omelette for that matter...I could throw up.
That's just you though.
If human flesh tasted good would you eat it?
No. There are lots of reasons not to eat human flesh other than taste.
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I did and some look good! I know about McDonalds and Burger King but wanted something a bit less bready. Morrisons sell them frozen but would ideally like to try to make my own even though I'm not usually much of a one for burgers. I wouldn't serve with bread roll but with salad & maybe new potatoes.
Cauldron Foods do good veggie stuff. And although I don't shop there often I'm having a boy's night in with my son (I'm an honorary bloke for the occasion) and we have some tofu weiner from Waitrose for dinner, to have with chips, buns and ketchup. And he does eat meat, and prefers these to the meat version. You can even slice them cold and have them in salads.
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Thanks Rhiannon. I laughed when I read about your tofu weiners, which I'd not heard of, because weiner or wiener is American slang for a little willie (learned from the Simpsons)! So I looked up tofu weiner & saw they are frankfurters which figures. I've had tofu and didn't like it one bit,plus not sure about healthiness of bean curd and soy but hope you enjoyed.
I had three cheese and kale rice pasta bake from Waitrose at lunchtime. Very nice. 4mins in microwave.
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Thanks Rhiannon. I laughed when I read about your tofu weiners, which I'd not heard of, because weiner or wiener is American slang for a little willie (learned from the Simpsons)! So I looked up tofu weiner & saw they are frankfurters which figures. I've had tofu and didn't like it one bit,plus not sure about healthiness of bean curd and soy but hope you enjoyed.
I had three cheese and kale rice pasta bake from Waitrose at lunchtime. Very nice. 4mins in microwave.
Tofu needs to have things done to it to be edible. I go by the fact that Japanese women have very healthy hormones thanks to eating soy - important at my age. :-[
I have to be the only person on the planet who has never really watched The Simpsons.
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Ah right, didn't know that about tofu and hormones. Might give it another whirl and see if it regenerates me!
(The Simpsons make good social comment, quite satirical. I'm a recent convert & now I watch old ones when I get the chance.)
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Soy sauce is good. Could drink the stuff.
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Oooh you macho man, you.
I like marmite.
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No. There are lots of reasons not to eat human flesh other than taste.
Exactly! There are lots of reasons not to eat animal flesh too! Its not just about taste.
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I'm feeling virtuous today with my vegetarian efforts. The fact that what I've been eating is much the same as I eat every day during the week is not relevant! I have to continue it when not on my own during evenings and weekends.
Seriously though, I actually don't fancy meat right now.
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I have to be the only person on the planet who has never really watched The Simpsons.
No you're not.
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Going off the point but this bit of your signature which I had not noticed before - So many homophobes turn out to be secretly gay... - I agree with completely!
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No you're not.
Ok, so there's probably some Amazonian tribespeople that haven't.
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Going off the point but this bit of your signature which I had not noticed before - So many homophobes turn out to be secretly gay... - I agree with completely!
I agree too. I have often wondered if that chap St Paul was a gay in denial.
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Ok, so there's probably some Amazonian tribespeople that haven't.
And me. Never seen a complete episode. Seen 10 minutes here and there over the last however many years.
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I agree too. I have often wondered if that chap St Paul was a gay in denial.
We know he wasn't a vegetarian.
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Sririam out of interest, do you wear or use leather goods?
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And me. Never seen a complete episode. Seen 10 minutes here and there over the last however many years.
Ooh, I'm in good company then. :)
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Sririam out of interest, do you wear or use leather goods?
Yes...I do have a couple of leather shoes. I thought they used the leather after the cows died naturally. :-[
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Most leather isn't even a meat by product, it is made from animals slaughtered in deregulated conditions that are truly appalling and just for their skin - far worse than those where the animal is killed for food. The chemicals used are incredibly polluting too. I buy second hand and vintage bags (not that I have many) and my biker jacket is fake but shoes are s problem - easier in the summer when fabric shoes are an option.
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Yes...I do have a couple of leather shoes. I thought they used the leather after the cows died naturally. :-[
That's true for a lot of them. Then I read what Rhiannon said, I didn't know about all that.
This forum is truly an education for me! I have loads of bags and leather shoes & boots, really like them. Agree abou using the fabric ones in summer, they are nice if they're good quality.
One step at a time.....
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In principle there should be nothing wrong with using leather and so on, after all they are just "leftovers" and need not involve cruelty to or slaughter of animals. However in practice that is not so, as nearly all animal products do subsidise and support the meat industry.
And.. that's only the tip of the issue. India, where the cow is sacred and half the population is vegetarian, is also the world's largest exporter of beef. Everything comes down to economics. I don't eat meat but my economic activity supports any number of people who do.
The planet itself recycles animals and plant bodies endlessly.
It's not an argument for any individual to be or not be vegetarian - that is about personal empathy and compassion.
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Yes. Years ago I felt I made a difference. Now I don't but I act in line with what I can manage as an individual.
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Most leather isn't even a meat by product, it is made from animals slaughtered in deregulated conditions that are truly appalling and just for their skin - far worse than those where the animal is killed for food. The chemicals used are incredibly polluting too. I buy second hand and vintage bags (not that I have many) and my biker jacket is fake but shoes are s problem - easier in the summer when fabric shoes are an option.
Biker jacket? :o
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Biker jacket? :o
Yes. What bit of that can I help you with as it seems to be causing some confusion?
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Here's quite a nice non-leather one -
http://www.topshop.com/en/tsuk/product/quilted-faux-leather-biker-5840660?geoip=noredirect&cmpid=ppc_pla_UK_ip&utm_medium=cpc&tsrc=vdna&istCompanyId=38aa0d7f-6514-4cb3-bbdc-df0d32d48b7f&istItemId=xxiapllppr&istBid=tztx&gclid=CNSUtvvgtdMCFe4Q0wodJ08HJw&gclsrc=aw.ds
I had one but grew - would like to say "I outgrew it" but what happened is I became too big for it, or it became too tight for me. Mine was leather. The above one looks quite good.
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I love mine. It's got a waterfall collar so I don't look like I'm hopefully wearing my daughter's New Look one, which is also non leather and looks like it cost three times what I paid for it.
I like customised denim bikers too.
Getting too big for things is a sign of fine living and is to be commended.
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Not for me it isn't! It's a sign of letting things slide.
(I've been veggie all week and will continue over weekend.)
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Yes. What bit of that can I help you with as it seems to be causing some confusion?
I can cope ;)
Didnt have you down as a biker type.
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They even have a biker jacket for me 😂
http://www.asos.com/asos/asos-leather-biker-jacket-in-black-with-rebel-rose-back-print/prd/7156919?iid=7156919&clr=Black&cid=11895&pgesize=36&pge=0&totalstyles=106&gridsize=3&gridrow=11&gridcolumn=3
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I can cope ;)
Didnt have you down as a biker type.
I don't have a beard.
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I don't have a beard.
Or a bald head, hopefully 😉 ( either that or they seem to often have very long hair)
All you need to be a biker is a bike, and a liking for a certain type of rock, AC/DC, type stuff.
It's got its own culture, sort of.
Rally's, dress code, ......
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Had these this evening with salad & coleslaw:
https://www.ocado.com/webshop/product/Amys-Kitchen-Gluten-Free-Manhattan-Veggie-Burger-Frozen/305823011?ULP_CAMPAIGN_ID=52&gclid=CP2NzO7fuNMCFcIp0wodZK8Cjg&gclsrc=aw.ds&dclid=CPLR8-7fuNMCFUEw0wod0GMOsA&dnr=y
I expected nothing of them but they were a gorgeous flavour!
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Old fashioned mac n cheese and peas for us. Comfort food for a Saturday night. :)
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Sounds delicious. I had mac & cheese during the week Thrusday I think. Love it.
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Animals we use for food and clothing should be killed as swiftly as possible to prevent too much pain. I have no problem with eating and wearing animal products.
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Not for me it isn't! It's a sign of letting things slide.
(I've been veggie all week and will continue over weekend.)
Its nice to know that you have been veggie all week. Great!
Being veggie is also good for health and is said to have less risk of many health problems. It is also good from a spiritual angle because it means you are willing to sacrifice your desires for the benefit of some other being.
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Quite honestly I am not finding it difficult Sririam so it's no sacrifice. I'm enjoying what I eat and don't miss meat at all so far. Planning meals is fun too but I will have to work on variety. Vegeterianism being a healthy diet is the icing on the cake! I suppose it will all work out cheaper in the end which will be a bonus.
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Something relevant to this...in today's CNN news.
http://edition.cnn.com/2017/05/03/health/germany-vegan-vegetarian-diets/index.html
This is about vegan substitutes for familiar meat food products.
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When thinking of a typically German meal, two particular items probably spring to mind: bratwurst sausage and a tender schnitzel.
Both are traditional, and both are made of veal, beef or pork, occasionally chicken.
But today, these classics have been transformed, going meat-free to embrace the growing number of vegetarians and vegans across Germany and to fuel the vegan movement itself.
"These new food products are quite tasty," said Stefan Lorkowski, vice president of the German Nutrition Society. "It's tremendous what food technologists can do."
Europe's first vegan supermarket chain, Veganz, began in the German capital, Berlin, in 2011. There are 10 stores across the country today and more across the continent, offering more than 4,500 products. More restaurants are also offering vegetarian and vegan options, as well as special food aisles at most major supermarkets, Lorkowski said.
....using survey data from 2008 and 2011 estimated 4.3% of Germans between 18 and 79 years old to be vegetarian, with the greatest number between the ages of 18 and 29. About 2% of the UK population is estimated to be vegetarian and 3.3% in the US. In most settings, numbers are greater among higher-income populations and city-dwellers, say experts, as well as among women.
Recent guidance from the United Nations has highlighted the environmental benefits of reduced meat consumption. For example, livestock are estimated to be responsible for 20% of global greenhouse gas emissions, according to the UN's Food and Agriculture Organization.
"The UK is a world leader" in veganism, Peggs said, adding that it was the first country to have a Vegan Society. That ideology arose from concerns over animal welfare, followed by the environment, meaning people did not necessarily seek meat-like replacements.
Sanders also believes that greater ethnic diversity in countries such as the UK, with the resulting wider range of foods, further affects the type of vegan and vegetarian diets people want. UK residents are commonly exposed to Greek, Indian and Cypriot diets that have many vegetarian options. "Most vegans do not think of meat as food ... (so) they don't want things resembling meat," he said.
Most experts believe the trend has not yet peaked, though they say it is unlikely to become the norm.
"There is a lot of concern around health," Peggs said. "So it will keep rising."
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Cheers.
Sriram
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I had a nice bacon sarnie for breakfast.
Anyway. Northern Europe. Pork and beer. Marriage made in heaven.
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;D
I've always liked bacon but have been OK without any since starting the veggie diet, put what I had in the fridge into the freezer, told family where to find it if they want any (and lamb chops, chicken portions, minced beef). So far no takers!
I was reading about things you can do which add a bacony flavour to meals. One was shiitake mushrooms with soy sauce. I cannot begin to imagine it but might try just to see. Still I'm managing alright without, husband too tho' I told him not to feel obliged to be vegetarian because of me & if he fancies a ham roll at work it's up to him.
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A month of being veggie except for two lapses when I unthinkingly got something out of the fridge to snack on, one was taramasalata. There wasn't much left so I finished the tub,didn't think about it until afterwards. The other thing was someone gave me a meal &it had a bit of chicken chopped up tiny in it, I'd never have guessed.
I'm enjoying it and will continue.
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A month of being veggie except for two lapses when I unthinkingly got something out of the fridge to snack on, one was taramasalata. There wasn't much left so I finished the tub,didn't think about it until afterwards. The other thing was someone gave me a meal &it had a bit of chicken chopped up tiny in it, I'd never have guessed.
I'm enjoying it and will continue.
Great Robbie! Keep it up! :)
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Thanks, I will. :D
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Vegetarian food porn
http://www.olivemagazine.com/recipes/vegetarian/best-ever-halloumi-recipes/
http://www.olivemagazine.com/recipes/vegetarian/best-ever-vegetarian-entertaining-recipes/
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Vegetarian food porn
http://www.olivemagazine.com/recipes/vegetarian/best-ever-halloumi-recipes/
http://www.olivemagazine.com/recipes/vegetarian/best-ever-vegetarian-entertaining-recipes/
Oh recipes.....! I thought there were pictures of Nigella!!! :( ;)
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Just for you sririam:
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=nigella+picture&tbm=isch&imgil=89IAf5oCkxv7tM%253A%253BVW5mm2O30KmB6M%253Bhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.heart.co.uk%25252Fphotos%25252Fcelebrity-photos%25252F15-sexiest-nigella-lawson%25252F&source=iu&pf=m&fir=89IAf5oCkxv7tM%253A%252CVW5mm2O30KmB6M%252C_&usg=__mWtDBI0pCoK1W32nyhTboexRhec%3D&biw=1366&bih=638&ved=0ahUKEwi3vLzJx_zTAhXLKMAKHf32BH8QyjcINw&ei=szUfWfeWMsvRgAb97ZP4Bw#imgrc=89IAf5oCkxv7tM:
Women admire Nigella too.
Rhianna the recipes are gorgeous especially the halloumi ones.
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Hraven between two slices of bread: https://www.google.fi/search?q=bacon+sarny+heaven&client=ms-android-samsung&source=android-browser&prmd=ivmn&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiRwf3R7_zTAhWE6CwKHU4XB5YQ_AUICSgB&biw=360&bih=512#imgrc=4ydcMeP6WREE_M:
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Thanks Robbie. Yeah...I have watched Nigella's TV cooking shows many times along with my wife.
Her way of looking at the camera and the way she tastes her food ....is generally considered as 'food porn'. :D
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What would happen if the whole world turned vegetarian....
http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20170612-the-consequences-if-the-world-decided-to-go-meat-free
More positives than negatives.
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What would happen if the whole world turned vegetarian....
http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20170612-the-consequences-if-the-world-decided-to-go-meat-free
More positives than negatives.
Well it's not going to!
The things it lists as positives, are not positives.
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What would happen if the whole world turned vegetarian....
http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20170612-the-consequences-if-the-world-decided-to-go-meat-free
More positives than negatives.
If your definition of 'vegetarian' allows the eating of milk products and eggs, you're on a loser, unless you're into genetic engineering. Milk requires the birth of calves, almost half of which will be male - what are you going to do with all of those?
Mushrooms are of course not plants - how do you know they don't suffer (being closer to the animal branch of evolution). how do you know plants don't suffer?
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Hi everyone,
Here are some vegetarian recipes for Easter...from BBC.
https://www.bbcgoodfood.com/howto/guide/vegetarian-easter-menu
Let the animals have a Happy Easter too!
Cheers.
Sriram
What if you're a Scorpio?
ippy
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If your definition of 'vegetarian' allows the eating of milk products and eggs
Why wouldn't it? That's strictly correct. It's not his definition, her definition, my definition or your definition: it's the definition. It's what the word means.
Now: there's a discussion to be had about whether vegetarianism is enough and whether people should really go vegan if they are serious about animal suffering, environmental impact, etc. That's a big old chinwag worthy of its own thread, and another discussion for another day. But vegetarianism per se does allow for the consumption of milk and eggs - it's veganism (different thing: hence different term) that doesn't.
Milk requires the birth of calves, almost half of which will be male - what are you going to do with all of those?
For myself, I wouldn't breed them at all in the first place. Supply exists only to meet demand, as I'm sure you know.
Mushrooms are of course not plants - how do you know they don't suffer (being closer to the animal branch of evolution). how do you know plants don't suffer?
Negative proof fallacy aside for the nonce (and I don't often say that), they don't have the neural equipment that we already know is associated with the subjective feeling of pain. Could we be wrong about this? Yes. Is there any evidence for being wrong about this? None whatever. Is it probable? No. Is "Butbutbutbut what about the plants feeling pain?" a dickheadish non-question typically posed by people more interested in point-scoring than anything substantive such as non-human pain, environmental degradation and so forth? Hell yes.
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Was thinking about what you said Dicky but Shaker has more or less said it for me.
Vegetarians go as far as they feel they can to minimise animal suffering, hence eating and drinking dairy products.
In this country there has been a revolution in animal farming in recent years. Calves stay with their mothers for longer and have a better life whereas in the past they were taken almost immediately after birth which was distressing for both mother and calf. Of course eventually they will either grow up into beef cattle or will be killed and sold as veal (veal is something I have never touched) - nothing is perfect.
We don't live in a vegetarian world Dicky so we have to make the best of it but organic milk comes from cows who are not intensively farmed.
Mushrooms are fungi, some people don't fancy them anyway because they feed off decayed matter but they do not have a nervous system, cannot think, so as far as we know they don't suffer. In any case, like plants, once they are picked they're dead.
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Actually, in India vegetarianism means no egg or even egg products like cakes and stuff. We therefore have eggless cakes, eggless mayonnaise and so on.
Most people (including me) reject mushrooms. Most Brahmins and Jains exclude even garlic and onions because they are are believed to induce sexual passion (mild aphrodisiacs).
Milk is accepted because, as mammals, milk is considered natural for humans. Milk was traditionally taken from cows only after feeding the calf. Leather was a post death product and hence accepted.
Veganism would be better of course.
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Vegan doesn't appeal.
At all.
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I exclude garlic and mayonaise but only because they're the two vilest food stuffs on the planet.
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I exclude garlic and mayonaise but only because they're the two vilest food stuffs on the planet.
I like garlic and mayo. :)
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I exclude garlic and mayonaise but only because they're the two vilest food stuffs on the planet.
I guess you haven't tried durian fruit then.
Or asafoetida.
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I've known quite a lot of people who won't eat mushrooms, can't bear to even see or think of them! Not an ideological stance, more about the way they are grown.
It's never occurred to me that onions and garlic cause passion. Well, well, well! I'm cooking French Onion Soup tonight!
Not eating eggs is understandable when you consider how hens have been treated,living in miserable conditions and existing only to lay egg after egg. It was pitiful. Same for the way poultry was reared in factories. It was quite scandalous.
We don't have battery farmed hens' eggs here now and personally I've only bought free range for as long as I can remember (seomthing else I've never touched is shell fish& crustaceans).
I wonder if the Hindu objection to eggs is because they are embryonic chickens & therefore type of meat/poultry.
Though some Hindus do eat poultry and fish.
(Rose I couldn't see myself going as far as being vegan. Vegetarian is far enough for me & must say I'm happy with that now. Went out for meal on Sunday, had a good vegetarian meal but remembered how much I liked sea bass and salmon in that restaruant in the past.)
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But mushrooms grow in the dirt and what is dirt really? Dead things which have either broken down or are in the process of breaking down.
It's true some grow on trees and stuff, but is that really different to this?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/gardening/gardeningequipment/11369289/Straw-bale-gardening-is-it-any-good.html
Not sure why mushrooms make people sqeemish
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They don't make me squeamish either Rose. I really like them & they're versatile.
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They don't make me squeamish either Rose. I really like them & they're versatile.
I like fresh ones, but tinned ones have to be used in something tasty.
Eating tinned ones in a fry up is a bit tasteless and remind me of slugs 😉
I'm not sure what goes wrong with the tinned sliced ones but they are a bit yuck if not flavoured up in some way.
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I've known quite a lot of people who won't eat mushrooms, can't bear to even see or think of them! Not an ideological stance, more about the way they are grown.
It's never occurred to me that onions and garlic cause passion. Well, well, well! I'm cooking French Onion Soup tonight!
Not eating eggs is understandable when you consider how hens have been treated,living in miserable conditions and existing only to lay egg after egg. It was pitiful. Same for the way poultry was reared in factories. It was quite scandalous.
We don't have battery farmed hens' eggs here now and personally I've only bought free range for as long as I can remember (seomthing else I've never touched is shell fish& crustaceans).
I wonder if the Hindu objection to eggs is because they are embryonic chickens & therefore type of meat/poultry.
Though some Hindus do eat poultry and fish.
(Rose I couldn't see myself going as far as being vegan. Vegetarian is far enough for me & must say I'm happy with that now. Went out for meal on Sunday, had a good vegetarian meal but remembered how much I liked sea bass and salmon in that restaruant in the past.)
Fertilized egg is of course no no. Unfertilized egg is just the egg getting released....err...sorry....but something like a woman menstruating. Not really food IMO!
Yes...many Hindus are non veg. Some people especially the poorer sections, eat everything including sea food. There is a gradation in food also. Normally the upper castes were strict vegetarians, while the lower castes could eat anything depending on their needs.
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I like fresh ones, but tinned ones have to be used in something tasty.
Eating tinned ones in a fry up is a bit tasteless and remind me of slugs 😉
I'm not sure what goes wrong with the tinned sliced ones but they are a bit yuck if not flavoured up in some way.
Never had tinned mushrooms.
Big mushrooms sliced and put in sauces or casseroles remind me VERY MUCH of slugs! So I avoid.
Big portabello mushrooms, whole, are nice.
I generally buy chestnut mushrooms, some big, some small, and occasionally button mushrooms,and use in all sorts. Nice in omelettes with cheese.
Sririam I've just had two boiled Brown Burford eggs, then read your post.
Never thought of it like that before :o.
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Why wouldn't it? That's strictly correct. It's not his definition, her definition, my definition or your definition: it's the definition. It's what the word means.
Shaker
Yes, I do know the difference between vegetarian and vegan, and have known it for at least the last 50 years. My response was really a gentle prod at Sriram, just to see what his take on the matter was. I was again specifically Sriram I directed my rather flippant final comments to, since he being a 'pantheist' Hindu is likely to endow plants and fungi with rather more 'sensibility' than you or many of the spiritually sceptic camp are likely to. He may for all I know believe that even rocks have consciousness, but no doubt he'll inform us on that.
My only serious comment was the one concerning the production of milk - and it is a very serious one, for anyone with grand hopes for humanity adopting a principally vegetarian diet. The fact remains that if people want milk (from whichever mammal), there is going to be a huge surplus of male offspring which will have to be slaughtered, unless the pastures of the world are to be munched away in a very short time. There is also the possibility of genetic engineering for more female offspring, but that's a can of worms (incidentally, I think that unusual sources of animal protein should definitely be explored, including locusts, which can otherwise bring about great areas of famine in hours).
The proposition that much of the world be given over to the growth of legumes - such as soya bean - to replace animal farming has largely resulted in giving an opening to shameless and morally bankrupt opportunists going to make a quick buck - as in Argentina. It also tends to favour the development of huge monocultures, which have often had disastrous agricultural results.
Is "Butbutbutbut what about the plants feeling pain?" a dickheadish non-question typically posed by people more interested in point-scoring than anything substantive such as non-human pain, environmental degradation and so forth? Hell yes.
Yes, it is a dickheadish question, as I've pointed out above, but the second aspect of your comment is so riddled with complexities, that I don't see any point in trying to reduce the argument to a binary 'vegetarian versus omnivorous' option for human sustenance. As I've said, the environmental degradation matter is well underway in some areas as direct consequence of going for the vegetarian option.
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Was thinking about what you said Dicky but Shaker has more or less said it for me.
Vegetarians go as far as they feel they can to minimise animal suffering, hence eating and drinking dairy products.
In this country there has been a revolution in animal farming in recent years. Calves stay with their mothers for longer and have a better life whereas in the past they were taken almost immediately after birth which was distressing for both mother and calf. Of course eventually they will either grow up into beef cattle or will be killed and sold as veal (veal is something I have never touched) - nothing is perfect.
We don't live in a vegetarian world Dicky so we have to make the best of it but organic milk comes from cows who are not intensively farmed.
Robinson
I've covered some of these matters a bit more seriously in my post to Shaker. I think you've hit the nail on the head with suggesting a pragmatic ideal, which is usually designated as 'compassion in world farming'. That should not be beyond the possibility of human endeavour, and less likely to foment the energies of the 'food fascists' who attempt to foist their dietary habits on the rest of us (I think there can be a slippery slope here, though: one moment it's 'let's all go organic', the next it's scientists involved in medical drug research being bombed to bits by 'animal rights defenders')
I'm a bit of an old sceptic about a lot of these earnest endeavours these days, though. It probably stems from the days when I worked in the offices of British Organic Farmers and the Soil Association (I started as a true believer). I did notice the glint of the fanatic in the eyes of some of these worthy farmers, and in their conversations they adopted a purist approach which I felt was simply ignoring aspects of genuine scientific research in agriculture, in the areas of chemical weed control etc. (Whilst happily espousing all modern developments in machinery and information technology, they seemed to wed all this to a rosy 'golden age' view of the world and nature. All a bit double-think)
I suppose my ultimate scepticism came when I was asked to translate the handbook of organic standards of the Spanish 'Vida Sana' organisation (that's the Spanish equivalent of British Organic Farmers). I couldn't help thinking how much these standards were more the result of a psychological predisposition rather than any real agricultural science, for the Spanish standards were entirely directed towards a vegetarian lifestyle! I imagine those worthy farmers were trying to expunge their share of the national guilt after centuries of tormenting and killing bulls*. Bullfighting is something that I utterly detest, but you'll never expunge it from the Spanish psyche - I once met a Spanish Zen Buddhist (Buddhism of course promoting largely vegetarian habits) who was a bullfighting fanatic. Talk about double-think!
I suppose one point I'm making is that so many of people's ideas on these things are determined not so much by genuine empathy for animals, but by psychological propensities which have nothing to do with the expressed concerns. In may be just a matter of sentimentality, or a dislike of eating meat because one doesn't like the taste. I even think this of the vegetarian habits of my closest friend, who is definitely greatly influenced in his attitude to animals by a degree of sentimentality, and not much objectivity. I think he even feels sentimental about grey squirrels, bloody vermin that they are. I'd eat the buggers, if someone would show me how to prepare them, or better still cook me up a stew ready-prepared!
*They do indeed eat the bulls (and the balls thereof) after each 'successful' matanza.
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Milk production is a difficult one, there's no doubt - it's the reason I have had to shelve my idea of ever having goats on a smallholding and making my own cheese. I try to do my best by buying dairy that has been produced organically, or free range. But I still wear leather when I can't find an alternative. I can't lecture anyone on their standards. I don't get the fashion for soya mince when lentils do the job better and I think it a good thing when people buy humanely farmed meat - or fish for their own dinner. But I cannot abide the thought of eating dead flesh. How it is.
Incidentally I don't get how organic farming can be vegan given the importance of returning animal matter to the soil.
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Obviously the whole world is never going to be 100% vegetarian at any time. If we manage 50% it will be good but I'll go with about 25% as most likely.
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Obviously the whole world is never going to be 100% vegetarian at any time. If we manage 50% it will be good but I'll go with about 25% as most likely.
Not going to happen.
The world population keeps growing out of control. Most people are raised to eat meat - I know I was - so, given that, even if you can persuade more people to go vegetarian, their numbers will just be swallowed up by more people over all still eating flesh.
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I even think this of the vegetarian habits of my closest friend, who is definitely greatly influenced in his attitude to animals by a degree of sentimentality, and not much objectivity. I think he even feels sentimental about grey squirrels, bloody vermin that they are. I'd eat the buggers, if someone would show me how to prepare them, or better still cook me up a stew ready-prepared!
"Whenever people say 'we mustn't be sentimental', you can take it they are about to do something cruel. And if they add, 'we must be realistic', they mean they are going to make money out of it." - Brigid Brophy
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"Whenever people say 'we mustn't be sentimental', you can take it they are about to do something cruel. And if they add, 'we must be realistic', they mean they are going to make money out of it." - Brigid Brophy
Not sure how much money there is to be made from squirrel stew. Even if it's on the menu at River Cottage.
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Not sure how much money there is to be made from squirrel stew. Even if it's on the menu at River Cottage.
Wrong chef - Heston Blumenhell would stick a £65.99 tab on it though knowing him.
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It would seem we are both wrong.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/foodanddrink/foodanddrinknews/9877019/Hugh-Fearnley-Whittingstall-serves-up-squirrel-in-Devon.html
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::)
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It would seem we are both wrong.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/foodanddrink/foodanddrinknews/9877019/Hugh-Fearnley-Whittingstall-serves-up-squirrel-in-Devon.html
That's just nuts!
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Moo.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-40253429
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Moo.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-40253429
I support one in Warwickshire. Hoping to visit some time over summer.
His brother-in-law told him he was "absolutely insane" to give away cattle which could fetch up to £40,000 at market.
It's just the almighty pound with some people, isn't it? >:(
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Yes, but if they were dairy farmers they were lucky if they broke even. With the imminent loss of EU subsidies you could argue there's more money to be made from the vegan market garden than dairy. And probably for a lot less work, if the arable farmers I know are anything to go by.
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Went to my in-laws for lunch today, their grandson (my nephew) & his wife were staying, we're always pleased to see them. He went to a wedding near to us yesterday and is staying with his grandparents until Monday morning. We got there about 11.45 and lunch was 12.45. My in-laws cooked roast lamb and.roast beef! I must say it smelled beautiful but I had cauliflower and purple sprouting brocllii in cheese sauce (I refuse to call it 'au gratin'), honey roast baby carrots, minted new, roast and cheesy mashed potatoes and Yorkshire puddings. They even cooked non-meat gravy for me! For pudding was fresh strawberries or apple and blackberry crumble. I was well impressed & full up.
We left just before 3, my two daughters arrived to eat leftovers and commune with their cousin. I expect they'll turn up here later.
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Good to know that you stick by your principles even under very tempting circumstances. :)
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I'm used to being veggie now, Sririam but I do appreciate it when others take the trouble to cater for me. At lunch time everybody else ate what I ate with their roast meat but there was a lot of it just for me and I was quite touched by my individual gravy.
Just woke up fancying a drink of water, wide awake now so decided to check in hence correction of spelling in previous post.
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Here are some more western veggie dishes...
https://www.bbcgoodfood.com/howto/guide/vegetarian-family-classics
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One of my daughters has become a veggie, it is one her fads, hopefully she will soon grow out of it, as usually happens. Until then she can sort out her own meals on the occasions she visits us.
Unpleasant.
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What is unpleasant?
Your post. I hope that it doesn’t accurately reflect your view of your daughter and her decision.
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It reflects my views exactly, she has had fads all her life, which never last. Her husband and kids are fed up with her latest one.
She’s an adult. It may or may not be a ‘fad’ but she is free to make her own choices. As for refusing to cook for her, don’t get that at all. Don’t you ever eat a meat free meal?
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One of my daughters has become a veggie, it is one her fads, hopefully she will soon grow out of it, as usually happens. Until then she can sort out her own meals on the occasions she visits us.
Many people are becoming vegetarians world over because of health reasons, animal rights or for spiritual reasons. These are normally well considered decisions and though they may occasionally falter, they are unlikely to go back entirely to their original meat diet.
Why do you 'hope' that she will grow out of it?
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Here are some more western veggie dishes...
https://www.bbcgoodfood.com/howto/guide/vegetarian-family-classics
In all recipes that use traditionally use mince I use a couple of cans of brown lentils and in ones that use beef chunks I use canned mixed beans. Cheap, full of flavour and healthy, and we eat well. My lentil shepherds pie recipe is up on the recipe section I think.
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Don't worry she will be taken out for meals by my husband when she next puts in an appearance. I dislike cooking and only do my regular meals, whoever visits these days.
So you aren’t aware that you would benefit by not eating meat with every meal?
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I didn't say I ate meat at every meal. Anyway what I eat is entirely up to me, just as what you eat is entirely up to you.
Indeed. But if you enjoy meat free eating I fail to see why you won’t cook those meals when your daughter visits rather than forcing her to bring her own food.
It is incredibly disheartening to have something you want to try dismissed as a ‘fad’ by people who could be supportive instead. No wonder your daughter often ends up abandoning her choices - assuming you are accurate in that description of her.
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I'm surprised by what you said LR. It's not difficult to make a simple veggie meal - cauliflower or macaroni cheese for example, with some potatoes and salad or green beans. You can buy that sort of stuff ready made to go in the freezer and it's not bad.
As for fads, most people have them from time to time but deciding to be a vegetarian as a mature adult is not usually a fad. It might not last if other people go on about it, taking the piss and criticising - in that case she might feel depressed & stop eating altogether. .
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Especially when it sounds like the whole family have been roped into the eye rolling ‘isn’t mummy stupid’ thing.
Maybe being vegetarian is something she’s always considered but not had the courage to attempt before.
The drip drip drip of put downs is depressing.
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Yes! That's what I was getting at when I said she might stop eating altogether.
It's also inhospitable in the extreme not to provide a meal for a vegetarian when it is so easy to do. Even a mushroom omelette with some salad or veg would do.
I've imagined Littleroses as a type of earth mother/grandmother person so this came as a great surprise. However, I don't want LR to feel 'got at', I've said me bit & will move on.
(Jacket potato with cheese and beans and a side salad is lovely. Goodlife sausages made of cauliflower and mature cheddar with truffle oil are gorgeous :D.)
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I would never describe myself as an 'earth mother' ye gods, what a ghastly thought! :o
People on-line make assumptions about me, but if they met me in real life I think they would be surprised. I get on fine with my children/grandchildren. I am not afraid to say what I think even if it doesn't always make me popular, similarly they tell me exactly what they think of me too, which is fine, I have no problem with that at all.
I am not a lovey dovey type of person, but the kids know I care and help them out whenever there is a need financially, which is much appreciated. I used to be a hands on granny too when the grandchildren were younger.
My husband's disability was not in our game plan for marriage, so it came as a massive shock. As I have said before I have stepped up and looked out for the guy since it happened in 2006, knowing full well he would have consigned me to a home tout suite. However, if he becomes any worse, like being unable to attend to his needs or gets dementia like his older brother, I would definitely consign him to a home. I don't feel guilty about that, I have a right to my life too.
I am far from perfect, but I would not wish to be any different, as I wouldn't be me.
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Yeah...but as long as you don't look down of vegetarianism...that's all right I suppose.
I know some people (westerners & Indians) who believe vegetarianism is a lot of nonsense....only for wimps. Eating meat is macho.
Some Christians also disapprove of vegetarians because they believe that God has intended people to eat meat.
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Yet human beings started off vegetarian! I've never heard Christians saying God intended us to eat meat but it doesn't surprise me. I suppose it comes from Bible stories - fatted calves, red heifers, lamb, fish and all the creatures that went into the ark.
It's a choice, quite a healthy one too if done properly.
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Yet human beings started off vegetarian! I've never heard Christians saying God intended us to eat meat but it doesn't surprise me. I suppose it comes from Bible stories - fatted calves, red heifers, lamb, fish and all the creatures that went into the ark.
It's a choice, quite a healthy one too if done properly.
Have you any evidence supporting that statement?
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Yet human beings started off vegetarian! I've never heard Christians saying God intended us to eat meat but it doesn't surprise me. I suppose it comes from Bible stories - fatted calves, red heifers, lamb, fish and all the creatures that went into the ark.
It's a choice, quite a healthy one too if done properly.
All Abrahamic religions believe that meat should be eaten. It probably has something to do with the lamb being offered to God as sacrifice instead of Isaac (or Ishmail)...which is then eaten. Jews believe that burnt offerings made to God should be eaten.
It probably has a lot to do with the fact that the Abrahamic religions originated in the Middle east where agriculture was much more difficult than rearing animals. Eating sheep and goats was perhaps the default thing to do.
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Yet human beings started off vegetarian!
Like LR, I would like to know the provenance of this assertion.
My understanding is that Lucy, Australopithecus afarensis, born about 3 million years ago - had dentition not greatly different from our own and quite likely ate plant material and animal flesh. It has been suggested that the presence of fossilised turtle egg shells nearby indicates that she was searching for eggs when she died.
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All Abrahamic religions believe that meat should be eaten. It probably has something to do with the lamb being offered to God as sacrifice instead of Isaac (or Ishmail)...which is then eaten. Jews believe that burnt offerings made to God should be eaten.
It probably has a lot to do with the fact that the Abrahamic religions originated in the Middle east where agriculture was much more difficult than rearing animals. Eating sheep and goats was perhaps the default thing to do.
I used to be a Christian and I did find this attitude among some Christians (a minority). Not because of the sacrifice of the lamb specifically, but because of a belief that it was an ingratitude not to eat meat which was a gift from God.
I and some of my Christian friends were vegetarian and for us it was an expression of our faith as well as a lifestyle choice. At the time it was hard to find decent humanely reared meat and we felt that it went against the idea of 'stewardship' (caring for God's creation) to eat factory farmed produce.
Looking back on it now I realise that the part of me that I was denying (my pagan/panthesim) was having an influence. :)
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Like LR, I would like to know the provenance of this assertion.
My understanding is that Lucy, Australopithecus afarensis, born about 3 million years ago - had dentition not greatly different from our own and quite likely ate plant material and animal flesh. It has been suggested that the presence of fossilised turtle egg shells nearby indicates that she was searching for eggs when she died.
I would have thought in the absence of farming meat eating would have been necessity for survival.
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Yet human beings started off vegetarian! I've never heard Christians saying God intended us to eat meat but it doesn't surprise me. I suppose it comes from Bible stories - fatted calves, red heifers, lamb, fish and all the creatures that went into the ark.
It's a choice, quite a healthy one too if done properly.
The Miocene apes may have been. As soon as humanoid branching had occurred, there is evidence of meat-eating and perhaps cannibalism. According to Prof Raymond Dart, Konrad Lorenz, Desmond Morris et al., anyway. People like Leakey have disputed this grim perspective on human evolution, and the evidence is controversial, but there are still strong arguments.
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Some more...
https://www.bbcgoodfood.com/howto/guide/vegetarian-family-comfort-food-recipes
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Some more...
https://www.bbcgoodfood.com/howto/guide/vegetarian-family-comfort-food-recipes
No thanks, those veggie recipes would definitely upset my stomach, BIG TIME!
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No thanks, those veggie recipes would definitely upset my stomach, BIG TIME!
Its all in your mind . You just don't like the idea of vegetarianism. :D
You should start getting used to it. Its likely to grow in the coming years.
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No thanks, those veggie recipes would definitely upset my stomach, BIG TIME!
What in those recipes would upset your stomach?
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Its all in your mind . You just don't like the idea of vegetarianism. :D
You should start getting used to it. Its likely to grow in the coming years.
It isn't all in my mind at all, there are certain vegetables and fruits which upset me in my old age.
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Jerusalem artichokes, Littleroses, Jerusalem artichokes.
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Fava beans?
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Jerusalem artichokes, Littleroses, Jerusalem artichokes.
YUCK
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Fava beans?
Never heard of them.
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Never heard of them.
They are broad beans, which apparently you have an intense aversion to (your post #34 in "Why we garden")
'Fava' is the term the Americans use, which is originally an Italian word (from the Latin 'faba')
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They are broad beans, which apparently you have an intense aversion to (your post #34 in "Why we garden")
'Fava' is the term the Americans use, which is originally an Italian word (from the Latin 'faba')
Yes of course they are, ghastly things too. They nearly killed our adopted DS son when he was a baby. He has a blood condition, rare to the UK, we knew nothing about. I gave him some of the beans, which are a no no for anyone with this condition. :o
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Morning all!
For the veggies, something I have discovered, had a few times now:
Higgedy Pie - cauliflower cheese with ciabatta and thyme crumble.
Absolutely lovely, they do other flavours too - feta and spinach etc, so far i've only had the cauliflower one. I will try out others eventually.
Nice with new potatoes or chips and salad with coleslaw. The pastry surrounding is quite light and the topping is crumble. Yum!
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No thanks!
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You're not a vegetarian Littleroses so may not appeal tho' I always loved cauliflower au gratin even when a meat eater, usually home made. Obviously a vegetarian needs to eat more than just that sort of pie but it is very tasty and surrounded by salad, potatoes (however cooked), and coleslaw is quite nutritious.
My husb (Chas) likes it very much indeed and he's a steak man! Went out yesterday evening with my brother in law and three nephews for a meal at an Argentinian (or maybe Brazilian) restaurant in Blackheath & had steak with accompaniments. Yet he loves Higgedy pies! We all like different things. There's no right or wrong.
Sometimes I fancy salmon, especially if I see it cooked on the TV, but that's how life goes. A carvery - which always has veggie options - smells lovely too. I'll often have cauliflower and cheese sauce there with roasties - & Yorkshire puddings! I don't ask about what fat is used but have been told it's usually olive or veggie oil. As long as it doesn't leave an oily taste I don't mind.
Roast chicken, marinated in honey and mustard with white wine poured over, is tempting too but I'm OK with a variety of veg, 'specially if served with sauce like caul. au gratin, plus nice potatoes etc. Non-meat gravy is easy if well seasoned.
Goodfellows cheesy sausages are lovely as are feta and spinach lattice flans.
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I really dislike the taste of cauliflower.
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If you don’t want to say something nice why say anything, Floo?
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Robbie, I make a big veggie hot pot with celery, parsnips, carrots, onions and lentils topped with potato and serve that with home made Yorkshire puddings and a green veg. It’s gorgeous, mid week or on Sunday.
Not having that today though as I’m going out for lunch. Very traditional pub near here does amazing veggie options including Sunday lunch. Will report back later with what I end up having. :D
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Sounds good to me Rhiannon. We all like different things eg I hate coconut in cakes. Don't mind coconut milk in curries, etc. When I was at school I couldn't stand the lumpy mash and cabbage they served, everything with brown (very brown) gravy! It was a relief when we could take a packed lunch (fish and chips once a week was fine of course :D). My ol' man loved the liver and bacon at school with thick gravy - no accounting for taste.
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Just had a look at today’s menu online. As I don’t like coconut in curry (the second veggie option) I’ll be having the spiced sweet potato soup followed by spinach, mushroom and pine nut strudel.
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If you don’t want to say something nice why say anything, Floo?
That could apply to you too on other topics! ;D
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That could apply to you too on other topics! ;D
I don’t interrupt other people’s discussions on things that they like/love just to shout ‘yuck’ at them. Not unless it’s Jacob Reed Mogg they like at any rate.
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I don’t interrupt other people’s discussions on things that they like/love just to shout ‘yuck’ at them. Not unless it’s Jacob Reed Mogg they like at any rate.
You are just as bad Rhi, but let's leave it at that.
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You are just as bad Rhi, but let's leave it at that.
That’s your opinion, but I think what you actually mean is that I disagree with your prejudices. Which I do. Vehemently.
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I'm not a vegetarian, love cauliflower, as I do most vegetables. One of my favourite dishes is a Greek salad as long as it's prepared with genuine feta cheese, rather than the supermarket variety.
Also love yogurt with honey, or cherries marinated with honey.
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I'm not a vegetarian, love cauliflower, as I do most vegetables. One of my favourite dishes is a Greek salad as long as it's prepared with genuine feta cheese, rather than the supermarket variety.
Also love yogurt with honey, or cherries marinated with honey.
Cauliflower is a gift from the gods, you can do so much with it. Love it roasted with Parmesan, in a masala or in old fashioned cauliflower cheese with broccoli and leeks.
I like yoghurt and honey too, with some toasted oats and/or nuts.
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I'm not a vegetarian, love cauliflower, as I do most vegetables. One of my favourite dishes is a Greek salad as long as it's prepared with genuine feta cheese, rather than the supermarket variety.
Also love yogurt with honey, or cherries marinated with honey.
Sounds like sheer bliss to me Rhi!
Cauliflower is a gift from the gods, you can do so much with it. Love it roasted with Parmesan, in a masala or in old fashioned cauliflower cheese with broccoli and leeks.
I like yoghurt and honey too, with some toasted oats and/or nuts.
All good stuff, we'd enjoy sharing a meal tho' I prefer the purple sprouting broccoli to the big variety.Leeks are great.
Around Christmas, I bought some of that cauliflower that looks like little Christmas trees! Frozen and still in freezer but intend to give it an airing next weekend. Didn't do much cooking over weekend as working, a couple of hours morning and same in afternoon on Sat., went in on Sunday (Sunday working doesn't happen very often). I had soup (detailed below), husband had chicken and sweetcorn and fish fingers in a roll & was quite happy with all that! He's a good cook but neither of us felt like doing much in way of cooking & were happy with what we had.
For 'simple' I love broccoli and stilton soup - have had all sorts, including fresh which ol' man bought from Sains., but most of all like tinned Cross & Blackwell. I can make it myself and have made it but it's handy to have it in cupboard. Also like Heinz cream of tomato, especially if not well.
Ta ta 4 now, off 2 wk in a min. CU lata.
I'm a 'cheesy' person, enjoy most cheeses. Was disappointed to have to throw away a bit that had been in fridge from Christmas - some does go off.
Pine nuts in things is lovely and lentils are marvellous.
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cauliflower au gratin
If you are going to use French - do it properly:
chou-fleur au gratin
I have a friend who is gluten intolerant (she has coeliac disease). For her I make chou-fleur au gratin as a soufflet. I also put oatflakes into a coffee grinder to make flour (coffee flavoured oat flour - it seems to be ok). Incidentally, she is fed up with people refusing wheatflour products in the belief that they are removing a health hazard from their diet. She points out that she has an immune-system problem - not a trivial affectation!
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1/4 of dinners in UK vegetarian/vegan
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42973870
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I really dislike the taste of cauliflower.
I really love the taste of cauliflower.