Author Topic: WUMS for Jesus!  (Read 14814 times)

Shaker

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #50 on: April 19, 2015, 10:38:04 AM »
As for kowtowing or bowing down to anyone - as a Christian, nor do I - so that's at least two of us.
So you never kneel, then?
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SusanDoris

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #51 on: April 19, 2015, 11:00:31 AM »
If Floo's comments on an online forum make her that, you really need to get out more.
Shaker, I would have to agree - at least to an degree with Matthew on this.  I have often found Floo to be extremely intolerant in certain aspects of her understanding of and attitude to Christianity: assuming, for instance, that the way she was brung up is the norm for Christian families.
Why should Floo be tolerant of religions that are based on numerous falsehoods, including the supposed existence of several supernatural beings and happpenings that ddefy the laws of physics
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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #52 on: April 19, 2015, 11:20:31 AM »
If Floo's comments on an online forum make her that, you really need to get out more.
Shaker, I would have to agree - at least to an degree with Matthew on this.  I have often found Floo to be extremely intolerant in certain aspects of her understanding of and attitude to Christianity: assuming, for instance, that the way she was brung up is the norm for Christian families.
Why should Floo be tolerant of religions that are based on numerous falsehoods, including the supposed existence of several supernatural beings and happpenings that defy the laws of physics
As far as I know virgin birth is possible and materialism dictates that material is the substrate for life therefore resurrection not against the laws of physics unless you believe in a soul.

Please state what laws of physics are being defied.

Or that the laws of physics hold good everywhere at all times for that matter.

Since you have categorically said they are false the burden of proof is now on you.
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Shaker

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #53 on: April 19, 2015, 11:28:26 AM »
As far as I know virgin birth is possible
How does that happen in humans, then?
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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #54 on: April 19, 2015, 11:36:23 AM »
As far as I know virgin birth is possible
How does that happen in humans, then?
I think we all know how it can happen now Shaker. The point is it is not against the laws of physics as genetic engineering is not against the laws of physics.

what I want to know is:

What things are hence against the laws of physics.

Secondly...if someone states that they are against the laws of physics do they think that these laws are eternal or whether they and we can contemplate the laws not being eternal.
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Sassy

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #55 on: April 19, 2015, 12:44:16 PM »

Right and wrong on both sides but never Christ or God. They did nothing

There's a reason for that ;)
We both know that wasn't what was meant. ;D
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Hope

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #56 on: April 19, 2015, 03:04:44 PM »
Why should Floo be tolerant of religions that are based on numerous falsehoods, including the supposed existence of several supernatural beings and happpenings that ddefy the laws of physics
You could equally ask why any of us should be tolerant of anything that requires us to trust any interpretation of things by another human - something that, as you know, occurs within the scientific community.
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Floo

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #57 on: April 19, 2015, 03:19:23 PM »
Why should Floo be tolerant of religions that are based on numerous falsehoods, including the supposed existence of several supernatural beings and happpenings that ddefy the laws of physics
You could equally ask why any of us should be tolerant of anything that requires us to trust any interpretation of things by another human - something that, as you know, occurs within the scientific community.

At least science has some evidence to interpret, religion has absolutely none.
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Shaker

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #58 on: April 19, 2015, 03:26:17 PM »
Why should Floo be tolerant of religions that are based on numerous falsehoods, including the supposed existence of several supernatural beings and happpenings that ddefy the laws of physics
You could equally ask why any of us should be tolerant of anything that requires us to trust any interpretation of things by another human - something that, as you know, occurs within the scientific community.

Because there's nothing else - there's no alternative; because science has an inbuilt methodology to eliminate human bias, partiality and preference as far as possible and to ensure that its productions are, depending on context, testable, repeatable and shareable.

That's why.
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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #59 on: April 19, 2015, 03:28:03 PM »
Why should Floo be tolerant of religions that are based on numerous falsehoods, including the supposed existence of several supernatural beings and happpenings that ddefy the laws of physics
You could equally ask why any of us should be tolerant of anything that requires us to trust any interpretation of things by another human - something that, as you know, occurs within the scientific community.

Because there's nothing else - there's no alternative; because science has an inbuilt methodology to eliminate human bias, partiality and preference as far as possible and to ensure that its productions are, depending on context, testable, repeatable and shareable.

That's why.
But Carroll wants to get rid of falsifiability in science doesn't he or is that just in the field in which he works?
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Shaker

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #60 on: April 19, 2015, 03:32:35 PM »
Does he?
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Hope

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #61 on: April 19, 2015, 05:17:17 PM »
Because there's nothing else - there's no alternative; because science has an inbuilt methodology to eliminate human bias, partiality and preference as far as possible and to ensure that its productions are, depending on context, testable, repeatable and shareable.

That's why.
Does it?  Shortly after I finished my teacher training, I seem to remember that certain long-favoured educational principles were shown to have been falsified by the scientist in question (Burt(?) iirc).  Then, of course, we had Kinsey and his erroneous material regarding sexuality - something that was accepted by the scientific community for some time.  That's just a couple of examples which - whilst the errors have now been uncovered - were allowed to influence public practice for various periods of time.

An other problem, of course, is that when such false material is accepted, 'testable, repeatable and shareable' becomes obsolete.  How long does it take to iron out 'tested, repeatable and shareable' outcomes that have been based on such erroneous material?

Finally, for now, is whilst a lot of scientific material is based on observation and other important and valid ideas, they are often based on an element of guesswork.  Think, for instance, of the idea of carbon-dating.  This is fairly accurate up to the last 50,00 years, but beyond that period of time is pretty useless.  With a planet that is possibly as old as 4.5 billion years old, 50K is a pretty insignificant period of time.



« Last Edit: April 19, 2015, 05:19:02 PM by Hope »
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jakswan

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #62 on: April 19, 2015, 05:23:26 PM »
Does it?  Shortly after I finished my teacher training, I seem to remember that certain long-favoured educational principles were shown to have been falsified by the scientist in question (Burt(?) iirc).  Then, of course, we had Kinsey and his erroneous material regarding sexuality - something that was accepted by the scientific community for some time.  That's just a couple of examples which - whilst the errors have now been uncovered - were allowed to influence public practice for various periods of time.

An other problem, of course, is that when such false material is accepted, 'testable, repeatable and shareable' becomes obsolete.  How long does it take to iron out 'tested, repeatable and shareable' outcomes that have been based on such erroneous material?

Finally, for now, is whilst a lot of scientific material is based on observation and other important and valid ideas, they are often based on an element of guesswork.  Think, for instance, of the idea of carbon-dating.  This is fairly accurate up to the last 50,00 years, but beyond that period of time is pretty useless.  With a planet that is possibly as old as 4.5 billion years old, 50K is a pretty insignificant period of time.

I think the sad thing is you were teacher and know so little.
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Shaker

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #63 on: April 19, 2015, 05:26:23 PM »
Does it?
Yes, it does.

Quote
Shortly after I finished my teacher training, I seem to remember that certain long-favoured educational principles were shown to have been falsified by the scientist in question (Burt(?) iirc).  Then, of course, we had Kinsey and his erroneous material regarding sexuality - something that was accepted by the scientific community for some time. That's just a couple of examples which - whilst the errors have now been uncovered - were allowed to influence public practice for various periods of time.
And?

Quote
An other problem, of course, is that when such false material is accepted, 'testable, repeatable and shareable' becomes obsolete. How long does it take to iron out 'tested, repeatable and shareable' outcomes that have been based on such erroneous material?
Vastly less time it takes than to iron out erroneous material as enshrined in what some people for some reason regard as holy books.

Quote
Think, for instance, of the idea of carbon-dating. This is fairly accurate up to the last 50,00 years, but beyond that period of time is pretty useless. With a planet that is possibly as old as 4.5 billion years old, 50K is a pretty insignificant period of time.

As a wild stab in the dark I'd guess that that's probably why scientists don't use carbon dating for anything they believe to be older than around 50,000 years *head desk*  ::)
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Shaker

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #64 on: April 19, 2015, 05:27:02 PM »
I think the sad thing is you were teacher and know so little.

Of English, I understand.

Very definitely, emphatically, not of science.
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Owlswing

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #65 on: April 19, 2015, 05:32:09 PM »
If Floo's comments on an online forum make her that, you really need to get out more.
Shaker, I would have to agree - at least to an degree with Matthew on this.  I have often found Floo to be extremely intolerant in certain aspects of her understanding of and attitude to Christianity: assuming, for instance, that the way she was brung up is the norm for Christian families.
Why should Floo be tolerant of religions that are based on numerous falsehoods, including the supposed existence of several supernatural beings and happpenings that ddefy the laws of physics

Why not?

We are apparently required to be tolerant of her veherement and sometimes unpleasant rejection of our beliefs - so why are we not allowed to require her to be just as tolerant of our rejection of hers - and her way of expressing it!!
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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #66 on: April 19, 2015, 05:33:29 PM »
I think the sad thing is you were teacher and know so little.

Of English, I understand.

Very definitely, emphatically, not of science.
Are we talking about science here or the new Carroll variant of science, science minus falsifiability.....AKA Antitheism.
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Shaker

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #67 on: April 19, 2015, 05:42:38 PM »
Are we talking about science here or the new Carroll variant of science, science minus falsifiability.....AKA Antitheism.
There is no "new Carroll variant" of science: it's just the same science - you know, the same methodologically naturalistic/materialistic and therefore functionally atheistic, evidentialist, empiricist science that has you wetting the bed every night and jerking your knees and swivelling your eyes here every day.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2015, 05:44:26 PM by Shaker »
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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #68 on: April 19, 2015, 05:51:06 PM »
Are we talking about science here or the new Carroll variant of science, science minus falsifiability.....AKA Antitheism.
There is no "new Carroll variant" of science: it's just the same science - you know, the same methodologically naturalistic/materialistic and therefore functionally atheistic, evidentialist, empiricist science that has you wetting the bed every night and jerking your knees and swivelling your eyes here every day.
I hope you are right however Carroll received criticism for saying that if there was one idea that could be junked from science what would be his favoured exclusion. He came up with falsifiability and was 'rightly' criticised.
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Sassy

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #69 on: April 22, 2015, 11:42:27 PM »
Why should Floo be tolerant of religions that are based on numerous falsehoods, including the supposed existence of several supernatural beings and happpenings that ddefy the laws of physics
You could equally ask why any of us should be tolerant of anything that requires us to trust any interpretation of things by another human - something that, as you know, occurs within the scientific community.

At least science has some evidence to interpret, religion has absolutely none.

That is your theory just as the evidence for science is mostly theory...
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Shaker

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #70 on: April 22, 2015, 11:47:10 PM »
Uh oh ... spot the one who doesn't know what theory means ...  ::)
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Sassy

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #71 on: April 23, 2015, 12:13:36 AM »
Uh oh ... spot the one who doesn't know what theory means ...  ::)
Even a simpleton would not have written the above.
We know what theory means in science. Pity you don't.
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Andy

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #72 on: April 23, 2015, 12:16:33 AM »
Bloody hell, what knob took your muzzle off tonight?

jakswan

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #73 on: April 23, 2015, 08:09:52 AM »
Uh oh ... spot the one who doesn't know what theory means ...  ::)
Even a simpleton would not have written the above.
We know what theory means in science. Pity you don't.

Abusive, ignorant and proud a hat trick of my least favourite things.
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Hope

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Re: WUMS for Jesus!
« Reply #74 on: April 23, 2015, 08:14:04 AM »
At least science has some evidence to interpret, religion has absolutely none.
Citation required (and not one of your own statements, Floo)   ;)
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