Author Topic: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)  (Read 9274 times)

Gonnagle

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #25 on: May 18, 2015, 09:29:32 PM »
Dear Gordon,

Non fiction!!! ( yes three exclamation marks ) Sir Terry, any Discworld Novel.

We should have a Disc world topic on this forum 8) :P

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BashfulAnthony

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #26 on: May 18, 2015, 09:36:53 PM »
I defy anybody, atheist or not, to say that they have read the whole of the Old Testament - vast swathes of it are staggeringly boring and an utter waste of precious time, even in Jacobean English.

I have, and yes, the genealogies and the law do make for rather dry reading.

If you have read Leviticus and Deuteronomy I take my hat off to you.  THough I wonder why you would, unless you are Jewish!

Because they speak of Christ.

Are you sure you've read them?
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It is my commandment that you love one another."

Gordon

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #27 on: May 18, 2015, 09:39:31 PM »
Dear Gordon,

Non fiction!!! ( yes three exclamation marks ) Sir Terry, any Discworld Novel.

We should have a Disc world topic on this forum 8) :P

Gonnagle.

I tried Gonners - I really did, and more than once, but I failed!

I think that a Board for literature/poetry would be a great idea so that there could be threads for different authors. genres etc etc.

Gonnagle

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #28 on: May 18, 2015, 09:46:26 PM »
Dear Gordon,

Not everyone's cup of tea ;) I was hooked when I read Colour of Magic.

Gonnagle.
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jeremyp

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #29 on: May 18, 2015, 09:48:32 PM »

I've always thought that "Brave New World" should be required reading for everybody, we my wife and I were only talking about this yesterday.


I had to read that at school.  I remember thinking that the society Huxley described doesn't sound too bad, especially as I would naturally have been an Alpha.
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jeremyp

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #30 on: May 18, 2015, 09:52:00 PM »
Gdel Escher Bach: an Eternal Golden Braid.

Also Copper Silver Gold: an Indestructible Metallic Alloy

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BashfulAnthony

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #31 on: May 18, 2015, 09:52:02 PM »
Quote
Do we know it's the case that these 5,000,000 Bibles are actually sold, as opposed to handed out/given away?


How do you know that they're pretending?

I had to study the OT as part of my course at college, and it was excruciatingly ponderous and difficult.  It is fine if you are Jewish, but otherwise it is hard going - I am talking in particular of the Books of Leviticus, Numbers  and Deuteronomy, in fact the Pentateuch as a whole; and anyone, other than Jews, who says they have read them by choice, and finished reading them, and found them appropriate to any other religion, is a liar.  People say they have read the Bible, including those Books, because it makes them appear knowledgeable.

As to the numbers of Bibles sold  - five billion, not million  -  it matters not whether they were bought or given, the number is still the same. 
« Last Edit: May 18, 2015, 09:54:26 PM by BashfulAnthony »
BA.

Jesus said to him, I am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

jeremyp

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #32 on: May 18, 2015, 09:56:18 PM »

Though, as we know, there are many atheists who may have bought one, but have never read it, though they pretend they have.


Since you're still banging on about that, I put it to you that more atheists who own Bibles have actually read it (or a significant proportion of it) than Christians who own Bibles.  The only reason why an atheist would buy a Bible is to read it whereas Christians buy them because they are expected to own them.

I suspect more people have read all seven volumes of Harry Potter than have read the Bible.

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BashfulAnthony

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #33 on: May 18, 2015, 09:58:35 PM »

Though, as we know, there are many atheists who may have bought one, but have never read it, though they pretend they have.


Since you're still banging on about that, I put it to you that more atheists who own Bibles have actually read it (or a significant proportion of it) than Christians who own Bibles.  The only reason why an atheist would buy a Bible is to read it whereas Christians buy them because they are expected to own them.

I suspect more people have read all seven volumes of Harry Potter than have read the Bible.

Any evidence to support anything you said above  -  or just the usual atheist spin, and wishful thinking.

Checking:  Harry Potter book sales were up to 450 million at July, 2013.  A bit short of the 5 billion Bibles   Check your facts.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2015, 10:02:57 PM by BashfulAnthony »
BA.

Jesus said to him, I am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

Nearly Sane

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #34 on: May 18, 2015, 09:58:59 PM »

I read Dostoevsky when I was younger.  It is pretty dark stuff really, not very easy reading.

It can be difficult to get in to, yeah. I chose those particular books because they describe the dangers of nihilism and liberalism.

I love reading historical novels, as history is an interest of mine.  Too many to mention, but often, when picked at random, they can be poor reading.  But I very much like Phillippa Gregory, Bernard Cornwall, Elizabeth Chadwick, Edwin Thomas, Georgette Heyer - the list goes on and on!

Have you read the Colleen McCullough Masters of Rome series?

jeremyp

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #35 on: May 18, 2015, 10:02:01 PM »
I put it to you that more atheists who own Bibles have actually read it (or a significant proportion of it) than Christians who own Bibles.  The only reason why an atheist would buy a Bible is to read it whereas Christians buy them because they are expected to own them.

I suspect more people have read all seven volumes of Harry Potter than have read the Bible.

Any evidence to support anything you said above  -  or just the usual atheist spin, and wishful thinking.

Exactly the same amount of evidence as you have that the atheists who have bought Bibles don't read them.
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Nearly Sane

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #36 on: May 18, 2015, 10:11:47 PM »
 ::)
Dear Sane,

Who is this Tyson bloke, long lost cousin of the boxer guy.

His description of the Bible is very thought provoking, very Dawkinish >:(

I think I read that Art of War book, I am set for life if I ever decide to invade China.

Gonnagle.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neil_deGrasse_Tyson

BashfulAnthony

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #37 on: May 18, 2015, 10:14:00 PM »
I put it to you that more atheists who own Bibles have actually read it (or a significant proportion of it) than Christians who own Bibles.  The only reason why an atheist would buy a Bible is to read it whereas Christians buy them because they are expected to own them.

I suspect more people have read all seven volumes of Harry Potter than have read the Bible.

Any evidence to support anything you said above  -  or just the usual atheist spin, and wishful thinking.

Exactly the same amount of evidence as you have that the atheists who have bought Bibles don't read them.

Have you read the OT?  Have you read Deuteronomy?  Funnily enough, atheists always say they have, but can never say what the Book is about, let alone why they would read it.
BA.

Jesus said to him, I am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

Nearly Sane

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #38 on: May 18, 2015, 10:14:34 PM »


Quote
How do you know that they're pretending?

Well it's quite evident from what they post.  I defy any atheist to say, in honesty, that they have read the whole OT!

I have, even the very boring bits. I have done it cover to cover three times. To be honest the bit I find hardest is Revelation as it's nuts and makes me laugh too hsrd

BashfulAnthony

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #39 on: May 18, 2015, 10:19:31 PM »


Quote
How do you know that they're pretending?

Well it's quite evident from what they post.  I defy any atheist to say, in honesty, that they have read the whole OT!

I have, even the very boring bits. I have done it cover to cover three times. To be honest the bit I find hardest is Revelation as it's nuts and makes me laugh too hsrd

Why would you read, say, chapters 12 to 30 of Deuteronomy once, let alone three time?  Are you Jewish, and need to be aware of Judaic Law and customs?
BA.

Jesus said to him, I am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

ad_orientem

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #40 on: May 18, 2015, 10:21:59 PM »
I defy anybody, atheist or not, to say that they have read the whole of the Old Testament - vast swathes of it are staggeringly boring and an utter waste of precious time, even in Jacobean English.

I have, and yes, the genealogies and the law do make for rather dry reading.

If you have read Leviticus and Deuteronomy I take my hat off to you.  THough I wonder why you would, unless you are Jewish!

Because they speak of Christ.

Are you sure you've read them?

Yeah. And in the NT Christ himself says that the law speaks of him.
Rationalism leads to Protestantism leads to atheism.

BashfulAnthony

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #41 on: May 18, 2015, 10:24:58 PM »
I defy anybody, atheist or not, to say that they have read the whole of the Old Testament - vast swathes of it are staggeringly boring and an utter waste of precious time, even in Jacobean English.

I have, and yes, the genealogies and the law do make for rather dry reading.

If you have read Leviticus and Deuteronomy I take my hat off to you.  THough I wonder why you would, unless you are Jewish!

Because they speak of Christ.

Are you sure you've read them?

Yeah. And in the NT Christ himself says that the law speaks of him.

How is that relevant?
BA.

Jesus said to him, I am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

Nearly Sane

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #42 on: May 18, 2015, 10:26:33 PM »


Quote
How do you know that they're pretending?

Well it's quite evident from what they post.  I defy any atheist to say, in honesty, that they have read the whole OT!

I have, even the very boring bits. I have done it cover to cover three times. To be honest the bit I find hardest is Revelation as it's nuts and makes me laugh too hsrd

Why would you read, say, chapters 12 to 30 of Deuteronomy once, let alone three time?  Are you Jewish, and need to be aware of Judaic Law and customs?

Because when I set out to read something, I read it. Context across the board is important.

Gonnagle

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #43 on: May 18, 2015, 10:27:26 PM »
Dear Sane,

Bugger me! You are a bigger Bible thumper than me.

Okay let's all settle down, we study the Bible, it is not a novel, it is a work of art, it inspires.

Gonnagle.
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BashfulAnthony

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #44 on: May 18, 2015, 10:28:50 PM »


Quote
How do you know that they're pretending?

Well it's quite evident from what they post.  I defy any atheist to say, in honesty, that they have read the whole OT!

I have, even the very boring bits. I have done it cover to cover three times. To be honest the bit I find hardest is Revelation as it's nuts and makes me laugh too hsrd

Why would you read, say, chapters 12 to 30 of Deuteronomy once, let alone three time?  Are you Jewish, and need to be aware of Judaic Law and customs?

Because when I set out to read something, I read it. Context across the board is important.

That doesn't explain why chapters 12 to 30 of Deuteronomy need to be read by non-Jews, and certainly not three times.  Why did you feel the need to read it three times?
BA.

Jesus said to him, I am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

ad_orientem

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #45 on: May 18, 2015, 10:30:19 PM »
I defy anybody, atheist or not, to say that they have read the whole of the Old Testament - vast swathes of it are staggeringly boring and an utter waste of precious time, even in Jacobean English.

I have, and yes, the genealogies and the law do make for rather dry reading.

If you have read Leviticus and Deuteronomy I take my hat off to you.  THough I wonder why you would, unless you are Jewish!

Because they speak of Christ.

Are you sure you've read them?

Yeah. And in the NT Christ himself says that the law speaks of him.

How is that relevant?

Eh? Are you serious?
Rationalism leads to Protestantism leads to atheism.

BashfulAnthony

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #46 on: May 18, 2015, 10:33:59 PM »
I defy anybody, atheist or not, to say that they have read the whole of the Old Testament - vast swathes of it are staggeringly boring and an utter waste of precious time, even in Jacobean English.

I have, and yes, the genealogies and the law do make for rather dry reading.

If you have read Leviticus and Deuteronomy I take my hat off to you.  THough I wonder why you would, unless you are Jewish!

Because they speak of Christ.

Are you sure you've read them?

Yeah. And in the NT Christ himself says that the law speaks of him.

How is that relevant?

Eh? Are you serious?

What does it say about Jesus in Leviticus and Deuteronomy?
BA.

Jesus said to him, I am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

Nearly Sane

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #47 on: May 18, 2015, 10:35:49 PM »


Quote
How do you know that they're pretending?

Well it's quite evident from what they post.  I defy any atheist to say, in honesty, that they have read the whole OT!

I have, even the very boring bits. I have done it cover to cover three times. To be honest the bit I find hardest is Revelation as it's nuts and makes me laugh too hsrd

Why would you read, say, chapters 12 to 30 of Deuteronomy once, let alone three time?  Are you Jewish, and need to be aware of Judaic Law and customs?

Because when I set out to read something, I read it. Context across the board is important.

That doesn't explain why chapters 12 to 30 of Deuteronomy need to be read by non-Jews, and certainly not three times.  Why did you feel the need to read it three times?

They don't 'need' to be read but if I am going to read a book I read all of it, skipping bits reduces the overall book and reduces understanding. Regarding some parts as unimportant seems an odd way to read a book. The bits that you miss reflect what was seen as important then.

BashfulAnthony

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #48 on: May 18, 2015, 10:38:53 PM »


Quote
How do you know that they're pretending?

Well it's quite evident from what they post.  I defy any atheist to say, in honesty, that they have read the whole OT!

I have, even the very boring bits. I have done it cover to cover three times. To be honest the bit I find hardest is Revelation as it's nuts and makes me laugh too hsrd

Why would you read, say, chapters 12 to 30 of Deuteronomy once, let alone three time?  Are you Jewish, and need to be aware of Judaic Law and customs?

Because when I set out to read something, I read it. Context across the board is important.

That doesn't explain why chapters 12 to 30 of Deuteronomy need to be read by non-Jews, and certainly not three times.  Why did you feel the need to read it three times?

They don't 'need' to be read but if I am going to read a book I read all of it, skipping bits reduces the overall book and reduces understanding. Regarding some parts as unimportant seems an odd way to read a book. The bits that you miss reflect what was seen as important then.

So you just read the lists of Jewish ceremonial do's and don'ts without wondering why it is in any way relevant to you as a non-Jew?
BA.

Jesus said to him, I am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

Nearly Sane

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Re: Essential Books (merging '8 books' and Desert Island Reads)
« Reply #49 on: May 18, 2015, 10:48:17 PM »


Quote
How do you know that they're pretending?

Well it's quite evident from what they post.  I defy any atheist to say, in honesty, that they have read the whole OT!

I have, even the very boring bits. I have done it cover to cover three times. To be honest the bit I find hardest is Revelation as it's nuts and makes me laugh too hsrd

Why would you read, say, chapters 12 to 30 of Deuteronomy once, let alone three time?  Are you Jewish, and need to be aware of Judaic Law and customs?

Because when I set out to read something, I read it. Context across the board is important.

That doesn't explain why chapters 12 to 30 of Deuteronomy need to be read by non-Jews, and certainly not three times.  Why did you feel the need to read it three times?

They don't 'need' to be read but if I am going to read a book I read all of it, skipping bits reduces the overall book and reduces understanding. Regarding some parts as unimportant seems an odd way to read a book. The bits that you miss reflect what was seen as important then.

So you just read the lists of Jewish ceremonial do's and don'ts without wondering why it is in any way relevant to you as a non-Jew?

No, I read it in terms of how it is relevant to the rest of the collection, what it tells me about what they found important, what that tells me about the differences and similarity between then and now, between them and the religion I grew up in, between them and me. It is useful to wonder what if any effect they have had throughout the history of the religions that used them as a base, whether any of it has relevance to the NT, whether as a piece of comparative religion they are unique or common, whether as history it is an attempt to mark them out as different and if so why - at least if I am not being too analytical that would do as a basic start.