Author Topic: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?  (Read 11908 times)

Outrider

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #50 on: August 07, 2015, 09:43:07 AM »
Depends, how many points for ....eating a bacon and monkfish sandwich?

Is there a touch of antisemitism about this thread?

No. Thanks for asking.

O.
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Hope

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #51 on: August 07, 2015, 09:50:17 AM »
No. Thanks for asking.
I'm not sure, O.  Matt has started a thread that seems to be antagonistic to many Jewish religous laws.  He has tried to hide that fact by appearing to ask people who may well not be Jewish whether they do any of the things that he refers to, but it is clearly a criticism of Jewish religious law.
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Rhiannon

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #52 on: August 07, 2015, 10:01:21 AM »
Matt isn't being antisemitic, not least because he's Jewish by ancestry. If it's in the OT then it is valid to point out that many (most?) Christians ignore the finer points of Judaic law because it 'doesn't apply' yet quote it when they want to justify regulations on homosexuality.

But anyways, if you want some antisemitism this chap points out where you might find some.

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/daylightatheism/2009/07/new-testament-anti-semitism/

Rhiannon

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #53 on: August 07, 2015, 10:15:22 AM »
There isn't a single Christian view of the Law.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_views_on_the_Old_Covenant

Hope

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #54 on: August 07, 2015, 10:54:40 AM »
Matt isn't being antisemitic, not least because he's Jewish by ancestry. If it's in the OT then it is valid to point out that many (most?) Christians ignore the finer points of Judaic law because it 'doesn't apply' yet quote it when they want to justify regulations on homosexuality.
Few, if any, Christians quote the OT to the exclusion of the NT and other factors - many having nothing to do with religious teachings.  To quote the OT, as one of several sources, simply highlights the fact that the idea that homosexuality has been regarded as wrong throughout history isn't a problem in my view.
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Hope

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #55 on: August 07, 2015, 11:05:20 AM »
There isn't a single Christian view of the Law.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_views_on_the_Old_Covenant
First time I've actually seen a 'mobile' version of wikipedia on a PC screen.  Far easier to read that the traditional format!!

I would agree that there is no single Christian view on the Law, but as with many aspects of life, I think one has to take the view of the mainstream, and both academically and theologically, the non-applicability of the laws that are most commonly used to exemplify this link - those of eating shellfish or pork, or of combining two fibres in the same piece of cloth are very different to thse laws that govern how we relate to other human beings.  Experience tells us that the former set are little more than commonsense rules that were probably already in existence anyway.  The latter refer to aspects of life which are far more complex and which, in reality, are no different today than they were then.  As such, they are timeless, culturally non-specific laws.
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Outrider

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #56 on: August 07, 2015, 11:29:03 AM »
No. Thanks for asking.
I'm not sure, O.  Matt has started a thread that seems to be antagonistic to many Jewish religous laws.  He has tried to hide that fact by appearing to ask people who may well not be Jewish whether they do any of the things that he refers to, but it is clearly a criticism of Jewish religious law.

Something isn't automatically 'anti-semitic' just because it criticises Israel or Judaism. It's antisemitic if it criticises BECAUSE they are Israel or Judaism.

This is implicitly criticising Christians who pick and choose which elements of the Old Testament they will hold to whilst explicitly highlighting some of the absurd things that are prohibited.

It's mocking anachronistic superstitious nonsense, the fact that it's 'Judaist flavoured' is by-the-by, if it were Islamic tenets or Hindu tenets or cultural ideas like FGM it would still be a valid criticism.

There is a real trend of antisemitism in Europe at the moment - this is not a facet of that, this is a legitimate criticism of nonsense.

O.
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Hope

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #57 on: August 07, 2015, 02:32:19 PM »
There is a real trend of antisemitism in Europe at the moment - this is not a facet of that, this is a legitimate criticism of nonsense.
Except I would disagree with your decription of it as nonsense.  If you look at a lot of the laws that we now regard as nonsensical, they had good reasons for them. Cooking pork is difficult at the best of times, let alone in the desert.  Similarly with shellfish.  The practice of mixing fibres or using old wineskins for a new brew are both commonsense when natural materials are concerned.
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Outrider

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #58 on: August 07, 2015, 02:50:53 PM »
Except I would disagree with your decription of it as nonsense.  If you look at a lot of the laws that we now regard as nonsensical, they had good reasons for them. Cooking pork is difficult at the best of times, let alone in the desert.  Similarly with shellfish.  The practice of mixing fibres or using old wineskins for a new brew are both commonsense when natural materials are concerned.

And that's not nonsense, that's learning from previous errors or foreseeable problems.

'Don't do this because the sky-man will be angry' is nonsense. It might have been the best explanation they had available, but with hindsight it's nonsense.

To criticise it as nonsense is not to single out Jews (cultural, ethnic or religious), especially given that the implication was about Christians who selectively cite some of these objections (the ones without any perceivable benefit, typically) whilst ignoring the others. That's, perhaps, anti-theist, but it's not anti-semitic.

O.
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OH MY WORLD!

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #59 on: August 07, 2015, 03:26:29 PM »
You do realize the New Testament also condemns homosexuality Rhi? Read the first chapter of Romans for a starter. (verse27)

Hope

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #60 on: August 07, 2015, 05:33:23 PM »
'Don't do this because the sky-man will be angry' is nonsense. It might have been the best explanation they had available, but with hindsight it's nonsense.
Societies of all sorts, not only religious ones, have made rules out of commonsense concepts.  This is often to do with trying to reinforce the importance of the common sense.  A good example is the Hindu ban on killing/sacredness of cows.  Anthropologists suggest that before the arrival of Hinduism, there was a concern that the people in the sub-continent were killing cows without thought, resulting in shortages of milk, calves and dung (a vital item in regard to cooking, for instance).  There is evidence that there were laws in existence amongst the tribal groupings which were then swept up  into the religious ban under Hinduism.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2015, 05:41:18 PM by Hope »
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cyberman

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #61 on: August 07, 2015, 07:00:27 PM »
OK So was Jesus a Christian or a Jew ?!?!?!?

A Jew

cyberman

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #62 on: August 07, 2015, 07:01:50 PM »
Depends, how many points for ....eating a bacon and monkfish sandwich?

Is there a touch of antisemitism about this thread?

No. Thanks for asking.

O.

Is taking the piss out of the prohibition against eating bacon having a pop at Christians or having a pop at Jews?

Rhiannon

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #63 on: August 07, 2015, 07:27:33 PM »
You do realize the New Testament also condemns homosexuality Rhi? Read the first chapter of Romans for a starter. (verse27)

I know, but I don't understand why Christians also quote the OT law, which doesn't 'apply' to them. I've heard the Baptist minister in my own village do it.

cyberman

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #64 on: August 07, 2015, 07:31:24 PM »
You do realize the New Testament also condemns homosexuality Rhi? Read the first chapter of Romans for a starter. (verse27)

I know, but I don't understand why Christians also quote the OT law, which doesn't 'apply' to them. I've heard the Baptist minister in my own village do it.

Because homophobic Christians often have the habit of pretending to be guided by scripture, whereas in fact they are bringing their existing prejudices to scripture and finding bits which they think seem to endorse them. The massive inconsistency of them pretending to be guided by OT laws which clearly don't apply to Christians (e.g. pork, prawns, etc) reveals this.

Rhiannon

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #65 on: August 07, 2015, 07:42:41 PM »
I think you can have a bit of an applause for that post, Cybs.

Hope

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #66 on: August 07, 2015, 09:09:43 PM »
I know, but I don't understand why Christians also quote the OT law, which doesn't 'apply' to them. I've heard the Baptist minister in my own village do it.
Something can 'not apply' to me but yet have a impact on my decision on a matter?  For instance, as a Westerner, I am not required to walk a yard or two ahead of my wife or fiancee.  However, when I was courting my now-wife whilst living and working in India, we chose to follow Indian traditional behaviour so as not to insult the local people we lived amongst.   As for the issue of homosexuality, we can reference the fact that homosexuality has been regarded with revulsion through history and across cultures for good reasons.
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trippymonkey

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #67 on: August 07, 2015, 09:15:56 PM »
Some here rant on about Christianity supplanting Jewish religion & thought & Jesus did nothing of the kind - even in the ballsed up version of the Bible we have now.
He lived & died a JEW !!!!! FACT.

Did Jesus ever say OOH Let's start a 'new' religion in MY name??? EH???
AGAIN. Was Jesus a Christian or a Jew???
I'LL answer if it's too difficult or too inconvenient....
 JEW !!!!

Nick

cyberman

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #68 on: August 07, 2015, 09:50:59 PM »
Some here rant on about Christianity supplanting Jewish religion & thought & Jesus did nothing of the kind - even in the ballsed up version of the Bible we have now.
He lived & died a JEW !!!!! FACT.

Did Jesus ever say OOH Let's start a 'new' religion in MY name??? EH???
AGAIN. Was Jesus a Christian or a Jew???
I'LL answer if it's too difficult or too inconvenient....
 JEW !!!!

Nick

I've already answered, old boy. Put that handbag down. If you find anyone who denies that Jesus was a Jew, then you can go right back to feigning indignation. Meanwhile, take one of your pills, Bobo, and calm down x

Gordon

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #69 on: August 07, 2015, 09:57:16 PM »
As for the issue of homosexuality, we can reference the fact that homosexuality has been regarded with revulsion through history and across cultures for good reasons.

What 'good reasons'?

trippymonkey

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #70 on: August 07, 2015, 10:02:10 PM »
Some here rant on about Christianity supplanting Jewish religion & thought & Jesus did nothing of the kind - even in the ballsed up version of the Bible we have now.
He lived & died a JEW !!!!! FACT.

Did Jesus ever say OOH Let's start a 'new' religion in MY name??? EH???
AGAIN. Was Jesus a Christian or a Jew???
I'LL answer if it's too difficult or too inconvenient....
 JEW !!!!

Nick

I've already answered, old boy. Put that handbag down. If you find anyone who denies that Jesus was a Jew, then you can go right back to feigning indignation. Meanwhile, take one of your pills, Bobo, and calm down x

My reply wasn't aimed at YOU. This forum's not all about YOU, you know ?!?!?!?
I don't feign anything as I don't really give a s...

cyberman

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #71 on: August 07, 2015, 10:07:29 PM »
Some here rant on about Christianity supplanting Jewish religion & thought & Jesus did nothing of the kind - even in the ballsed up version of the Bible we have now.
He lived & died a JEW !!!!! FACT.

Did Jesus ever say OOH Let's start a 'new' religion in MY name??? EH???
AGAIN. Was Jesus a Christian or a Jew???
I'LL answer if it's too difficult or too inconvenient....
 JEW !!!!

Nick

I've already answered, old boy. Put that handbag down. If you find anyone who denies that Jesus was a Jew, then you can go right back to feigning indignation. Meanwhile, take one of your pills, Bobo, and calm down x

My reply wasn't aimed at YOU. This forum's not all about YOU, you know ?!?!?!?
I don't feign anything as I don't really give a s...

That's an awful lot of punctuation marks for someone who doesn't give a shit, Bobo

trippymonkey

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #72 on: August 07, 2015, 10:15:25 PM »
Mixing up my sentences, are we OLD boy ???

cyberman

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #73 on: August 07, 2015, 10:31:22 PM »
Mixing up my sentences, are we OLD boy ???

You might be, I'm not

Shaker

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Re: Do you do any of these things that are banned in the Bible?
« Reply #74 on: August 07, 2015, 10:42:46 PM »
As for the issue of homosexuality, we can reference the fact that homosexuality has been regarded with revulsion through history and across cultures for good reasons.
What "reasons" were these and why were they "good" according to you?

ETA: I see Gordon has asked the same question. I'm sure he'll be every bit as interested in a reply as I am.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2015, 10:58:53 PM by Shaker »
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