Author Topic: Rise the Christian Right  (Read 3688 times)

Rhiannon

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #25 on: October 09, 2015, 01:20:03 PM »
The Vatican City is an independent state. They have a religious bloke ruling them.

Anchorman

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #26 on: October 09, 2015, 01:24:10 PM »
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b06g59c3/we-want-our-country-back

Documentary about Britain First party. Just starting watching, it started with one of their supporters shouting 'we are a Christian country'.
Can a country be 'Christian'?  Can it be Islamic, Hindu, Buddhist, Pagan, ...?

It can be, where the fact that it has official faith which is written into the legislature, where religious figures are explicitly part of the political system and so on - currently I believe that means it's just Saudi Arabia and the UK... although I suspect ISIS would like to be included, but I don't think anyone's recognising them as a country at the moment.

O.



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What d'you mean by 'UK', Outrider?
As far as I'm aware, there is no estblished church in the UK.
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Outrider

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #27 on: October 09, 2015, 01:28:27 PM »
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b06g59c3/we-want-our-country-back

Documentary about Britain First party. Just starting watching, it started with one of their supporters shouting 'we are a Christian country'.
Can a country be 'Christian'?  Can it be Islamic, Hindu, Buddhist, Pagan, ...?

It can be, where the fact that it has official faith which is written into the legislature, where religious figures are explicitly part of the political system and so on - currently I believe that means it's just Saudi Arabia and the UK... although I suspect ISIS would like to be included, but I don't think anyone's recognising them as a country at the moment.

O.



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What d'you mean by 'UK', Outrider?
As far as I'm aware, there is no estblished church in the UK.

No, there isn't, but there is in England. Not that I said an established church was necessary; representatives of the established church in England sit in the UK parliament, and the head of state of the UK (and Scotland) is the head of the established Church of England - it's not a good situation any way you look at it.

O.
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Anchorman

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #28 on: October 09, 2015, 01:53:21 PM »
Who's arguing, Outrider?
Certainly not I !
Saor Alba gu brath!

Outrider

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #29 on: October 09, 2015, 02:18:20 PM »
Who's arguing, Outrider?
Certainly not I !

Misunderstood the depth of your point :)

O.
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Private Frazer

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #30 on: October 09, 2015, 06:59:24 PM »
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b06g59c3/we-want-our-country-back

Documentary about Britain First party. Just starting watching, it started with one of their supporters shouting 'we are a Christian country'.

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If BF are Christian, then I'm a chicken curry.

Strange. Of all the ridiculous shite they spout, their religious affiliation is something I'm quite prepared to accept.

O.
Yes because that suits your confirmation bias when any sensible person could figure out that instead of appealing to a traditional national churchgoing position they could equally appeal to tea drinking, black cab, pearly kings, bowler hats, page three and buttered scones for tea.

''We are a Bowler hat wearing nation''.

Outrider

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #31 on: October 12, 2015, 08:45:54 AM »
Yes because that suits your confirmation bias when any sensible person could figure out that instead of appealing to a traditional national churchgoing position they could equally appeal to tea drinking, black cab, pearly kings, bowler hats, page three and buttered scones for tea.

''We are a Bowler hat wearing nation''.

No, I accept their claim that they are Christians because I don't see any reason to think they aren't. It might wrapped up with a host of other world-view elements I find distasteful, but that's not sufficient for me to think that they are lying about it.

Why should their devotion to other antiquated notions be genuine, but their devotion to the idea of the Christian deity not be?

O.
Universes are forever, not just for creation...

New Atheism - because, apparently, there's a use-by date on unanswered questions.

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Humph Warden Bennett

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #32 on: October 13, 2015, 07:51:43 AM »
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b06g59c3/we-want-our-country-back

Documentary about Britain First party. Just starting watching, it started with one of their supporters shouting 'we are a Christian country'.

Mr. Golding was a BNP councillor on Swanley Town Council. Swanley is a troubled industrial town just inside of the M25, Golding did little for his constituents, since being a town councillor involved attending meetings rather than demonstrations. He then left the BNP because he wanted to be Fuhrer rather than a foot soldier.

Golding & his chums rant on about Christianity simply as an excuse to be rude to Moslems, he and his gang attempted to intimidate a group of local Muslims who wanted to extend their mosque in Keston, an affluent semi rural village between Bromley Common, and Leaves Green. As it turned out the extension was refused by Bromley Council because of logistics issues, Golding & co made no representations presumably because they do not know what "logistics" means.

He & his chums are simply a bunch of unpleasant thugs, they have no connection to Christianity, and YES I and others have posted to that effect on the online edition of our local rag.

Red Giant

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #33 on: October 22, 2015, 05:38:54 PM »
What is more defining for Christianity than accepting that Jesus is the son of God?
I think that's the Nicene Creed in a nutshell.  The teachings of Jesus aren't included.

Evangelical churches usually have a statement of faith that bangs on about divine inspiration and penal substitution.  But the teachings of Jesus still aren't included.

The RCs have the whole Catechism, which at least has the 10 Commandments in it.  Not so much about Jesus though.
 

ad_orientem

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #34 on: October 22, 2015, 06:07:49 PM »
I think that's the Nicene Creed in a nutshell.  The teachings of Jesus aren't included.

The Creed as given us by the Niceno-Constantinopolitan fathers was designed specifically to combat Arianism.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2015, 06:12:03 PM by ad_orientem »
Rationalism leads to Protestantism leads to atheism.

Sassy

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #35 on: November 18, 2015, 06:21:46 AM »
The Church of England Apostles Creed.


I believe in God, the Father almighty,
creator of heaven and earth.

I believe in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord,
who was conceived by the Holy Spirit,
born of the Virgin Mary,
suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, died, and was buried;
he descended to the dead.
On the third day he rose again;
he ascended into heaven,
he is seated at the right hand of the Father,
and he will come to judge the living and the dead.

I believe in the Holy Spirit,
the holy catholic Church,
the communion of saints,
the forgiveness of sins,
the resurrection of the body,
and the life everlasting.
Amen.

        
The religion is NOT CATHOLIC as the word Catholic means 'univeral' church.

But the teachings of Jesus still aren't included. 


As for Christ, of course to believe in Christ is to accept his teachings.
By statement of faith believing in Jesus Christ you accept he is the Son of God etc.

We know we have to work together to abolish war and terrorism to create a compassionate  world in which Justice and peace prevail. Love ;D   Einstein
 "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

ad_orientem

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #36 on: November 18, 2015, 07:42:12 AM »
That is not the Creed. This is the Creed approved by the holy councils:

We believe in one God, the Father Almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible;
And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the Only-begotten, Begotten of the Father before all ages, Light of Light, Very God of Very God, Begotten, not made; of one essence with the Father, by whom all things were made:
Who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven, and was incarnate of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary, and was made man;
And was crucified also for us under Pontius Pilate, and suffered and was buried;
And the third day He rose again, according to the Scriptures;
And ascended into heaven, and sits at the right hand of the Father;
And He shall come again with glory to judge the living and the dead, Whose kingdom shall have no end.
And we believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, and Giver of Life, Who proceeds from the Father, Who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified, Who spoke by the Prophets;
And we believe in one, holy, catholic, and apostolic Church.
We acknowledge one Baptism for the remission of sins.
We look for the Resurrection of the dead,
And the life of the age to come. Amen.
Rationalism leads to Protestantism leads to atheism.

Floo

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #37 on: November 18, 2015, 08:42:00 AM »
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b06g59c3/we-want-our-country-back

Documentary about Britain First party. Just starting watching, it started with one of their supporters shouting 'we are a Christian country'.

They are bunch of nutters, and as far removed from decent moderate Christians as it is possible to be! >:(
“The wise recognise their failings and laugh at their idiosyncrasies” RJG

Outrider

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #38 on: November 18, 2015, 09:02:56 AM »
The Creed as given us by the Niceno-Constantinopolitan fathers was designed specifically to combat Arianism.

It is, though, generally considered to be the defining characteristic of Christians, given the wide disagreements on what Jesus' teachings actually constitute amongst the various cults and sects.

O.
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Outrider

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #39 on: November 18, 2015, 09:04:39 AM »
As for Christ, of course to believe in Christ is to accept his teachings. By statement of faith believing in Jesus Christ you accept he is the Son of God etc.

However, different people believing in Christ believe different things about what he teaches. Unless you have something more than your usual boldly asserted confidence about what constitutes the 'true' interpretation of Christ's alleged body of work, we'll have to resort to the idea that Christians are those people who believe in magic-Jesus rather than just a possible historical one.

O.
Universes are forever, not just for creation...

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Sassy

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #40 on: November 27, 2015, 03:32:04 AM »
However, different people believing in Christ believe different things about what he teaches. Unless you have something more than your usual boldly asserted confidence about what constitutes the 'true' interpretation of Christ's alleged body of work, we'll have to resort to the idea that Christians are those people who believe in magic-Jesus rather than just a possible historical one.

O.

You need to go away and learn the teaching about Spirit and Truth.
We know we have to work together to abolish war and terrorism to create a compassionate  world in which Justice and peace prevail. Love ;D   Einstein
 "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

Outrider

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #41 on: November 27, 2015, 09:19:40 AM »
You need to go away and learn the teaching about Spirit and Truth.

No, I need other people to stop going away and pretending like you can learn anything definitive about these ideas in the absence of any reliable or testable sources.

Instead, I'd rather people went off and learnt about being nice to people, accepting differences and a live and let live attitude; that's not just the hardline religious people, or even just the religious people, it's just people in general.

O.
Universes are forever, not just for creation...

New Atheism - because, apparently, there's a use-by date on unanswered questions.

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BashfulAnthony

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #42 on: November 27, 2015, 12:35:36 PM »

What's this?  The rise of the Christian Provos?  I wondered what the vicar was fiddling about with under his cassock last week!    ;)
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It is my commandment that you love one another."

Shaker

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #43 on: November 27, 2015, 12:37:19 PM »
What's this?  The rise of the Christian Provos?  I wondered what the vicar was fiddling about with under his cassock last week!    ;)
Probably a choirboy.
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BashfulAnthony

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #44 on: November 27, 2015, 12:39:12 PM »
Probably a choirboy.

You've spoiled the joke now.
BA.

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

Outrider

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Re: Rise the Christian Right
« Reply #45 on: November 27, 2015, 12:40:33 PM »
What's this?  The rise of the Christian Provos?  I wondered what the vicar was fiddling about with under his cassock last week!    ;)

Looks like we might get to find out... http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-34940723 :(

O.
Universes are forever, not just for creation...

New Atheism - because, apparently, there's a use-by date on unanswered questions.

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