Author Topic: Ontological Argument.......Really?  (Read 11101 times)

'andles for forks

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #50 on: November 14, 2015, 08:22:58 AM »
What about you sticking to the question you've been asked for a change?
What about the questions asked of you guys?

You are acting as though you have the sole right to the inquisitorial role by portraying yourselves as the people who just want to know and who raise no questions in what you believe?

I've answered all your questions and will do again but for the time being this should be enough to keep anyone going......There is knowledge that only you can know yourself i.e that you are conscious of your own existence in a way no one else can be. Having established that then other similar types of knowledge, the existence of god for example are possible.

That is my overarching answer to your ''issues''. Shaker, it has been given. To continue as you guys always do that your questions go unanswered is a fat lie.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2015, 08:26:05 AM by On stage before it wore off. »
I like the ''made up in the fourth century'' hypothesis but I also like Bart Ehrman. There's only one way to sort this out. Use contradictory evidence as it suits your argument wheeeeyyyyy!

BashfulAnthony

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #51 on: November 14, 2015, 08:38:13 AM »
What about you sticking to the question you've been asked for a change?
What about the questions asked of you guys?

You are acting as though you have the sole right to the inquisitorial role by portraying yourselves as the people who just want to know and who raise no questions in what you believe?

I've answered all your questions and will do again but for the time being this should be enough to keep anyone going......There is knowledge that only you can know yourself i.e that you are conscious of your own existence in a way no one else can be. Having established that then other similar types of knowledge, the existence of god for example are possible.

That is my overarching answer to your ''issues''. Shaker, it has been given. To continue as you guys always do that your questions go unanswered is a fat lie.

Absolutely spot-on.  I have made this point before.  The atheists on here seem to think that it is the business of this forum to grill theists constantly.  They have nothing else to offer;  and by now nothing new to ask.  Best thing would be for them all think of something else to do:  they could try and be less confrontational and discuss subjects maturely  (talk of fairies, etc, is the stuff of the playground);  failing that, take up pottery, or something!
BA.

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It is my commandment that you love one another."

Floo

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #52 on: November 14, 2015, 08:41:55 AM »
One wonders if that evil so and so  (every bad word in all languages) of a deity was sitting on its cloud rubbing its hand and getting off on the terrible events in Paris. If it was omnipotent it would have been capable of stopping it! >:( >:( >:(
"When I die I hope I will be remembered with humour by my nearest and dearest."

BashfulAnthony

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #53 on: November 14, 2015, 08:43:13 AM »
One wonders if that evil so and so  (every bad word in all languages) of a deity was sitting on its cloud rubbing its hand and getting off on the terrible events in Paris. If it was omnipotent it would have been capable of stopping it! >:( >:( >:(

A sick comment, bred from ignorance.  Shame!
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Jesus said to him, 的 am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

Shaker

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #54 on: November 14, 2015, 09:09:32 AM »
Absolutely spot-on.  I have made this point before.  The atheists on here seem to think that it is the business of this forum to grill theists constantly.
It seems to be the business of theists here to reel out baseless assertions and unsubstantiated claims on a daily basis and not expect to be grilled on them, adding hypocrisy into their toxic mix by demanding evidence from all and sundry yet going into hiding when somebody asks them to justify their assertions. That's not the way it works, and nor should it.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2015, 09:14:04 AM by Shaker »
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BashfulAnthony

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #55 on: November 14, 2015, 09:14:53 AM »
 
Quote
It seems to be the business of theists here to reel out baseless assertions and unsubstantiated claims on a daily basis and not expect to be grilled on them, adding hypocrisy into their toxic mix by demanding evidence from all and sundry yet going into hiding when somebody asks them to justify their assertions. That's not the way it works, and nor should it.

You will keep on throwing out the same "accusations," and in doing so entirely validate my point.  It's luducrous, especially so from one  ( you ) who has little Biblical knowledge.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2015, 09:17:41 AM by BashfulAnthony »
BA.

Jesus said to him, 的 am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

Shaker

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #56 on: November 14, 2015, 09:19:39 AM »
Then show the accusations to be wrong. You don't get to be validated by simply saying that you are - that would be 'luducrous.'
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BashfulAnthony

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #57 on: November 14, 2015, 09:29:49 AM »
Then show the accusations to be wrong. You don't get to be validated by simply saying that you are - that would be 'luducrous.'

I'm not under cross-examination, by you, or anyone.  If you want to find some answers, do some more of your prolific googling;  or read a little theology.  After all, to listen to you one might think you've read most of the other books in the world by now!    Perhaps you could ask Floo to help you out:  she's read the Bible many times; though at present she's busting a gasket   -  she seems to be taking a leaf out of your book with her obscenities.
BA.

Jesus said to him, 的 am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

Floo

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #58 on: November 14, 2015, 09:43:03 AM »
Absolutely spot-on.  I have made this point before.  The atheists on here seem to think that it is the business of this forum to grill theists constantly.
It seems to be the business of theists here to reel out baseless assertions and unsubstantiated claims on a daily basis and not expect to be grilled on them, adding hypocrisy into their toxic mix by demanding evidence from all and sundry yet going into hiding when somebody asks them to justify their assertions. That's not the way it works, and nor should it.

If people post on forums they have to expect their beliefs to be challenged. I make no apology at all for making comments about the Biblical deity, which are not to the taste of some. However, although of course I don't believe it exists, I detest the way some of those that do behave. We have a few posters who have the temerity to call themselves 'Christians' whom Jesus might have been ashamed if he had been a halfway decent person. They slag others off, but have a total inability to see how unpleasant they are! I am repeating myself, a habit my husband frequently points out to me! But I will continue to bang on about the hypocrisy of those who give Christianity a bad name, as it does the Christians who are very good people no favours at all!
"When I die I hope I will be remembered with humour by my nearest and dearest."

BashfulAnthony

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #59 on: November 14, 2015, 09:46:28 AM »
Absolutely spot-on.  I have made this point before.  The atheists on here seem to think that it is the business of this forum to grill theists constantly.
It seems to be the business of theists here to reel out baseless assertions and unsubstantiated claims on a daily basis and not expect to be grilled on them, adding hypocrisy into their toxic mix by demanding evidence from all and sundry yet going into hiding when somebody asks them to justify their assertions. That's not the way it works, and nor should it.

Do you ever actually address the specific questions put to you?  You seem to class any Christian who questions your views as a "bad" Christian.  Would that be a valid criticism?  (Sits back and waits for an answer  -  expecting a very long wait.)

If people post on forums they have to expect their beliefs to be challenged. I make no apology at all for making comments about the Biblical deity, which are not to the taste of some. However, although of course I don't believe it exists, I detest the way some of those that do behave. We have a few posters who have the temerity to call themselves 'Christians' whom Jesus might have been ashamed if he had been a halfway decent person. They slag others off, but have a total inability to see how unpleasant they are! I am repeating myself, a habit my husband frequently points out to me! But I will continue to bang on about the hypocrisy of those who give Christianity a bad name, as it does the Christians who are very good people no favours at all!
BA.

Jesus said to him, 的 am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

Shaker

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #60 on: November 14, 2015, 09:52:56 AM »

I'm not under cross-examination, by you, or anyone.
A perfect illustration and example of my point.
Quote
Perhaps you could ask Floo to help you out:  she's read the Bible many times; though at present she's busting a gasket   -  she seems to be taking a leaf out of your book with her obscenities.
Which obscenities might these be?

Did she go and say 'bum' again, Bashers?
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BashfulAnthony

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #61 on: November 14, 2015, 09:57:11 AM »

I'm not under cross-examination, by you, or anyone.
A perfect illustration and example of my point.
Quote
Perhaps you could ask Floo to help you out:  she's read the Bible many times; though at present she's busting a gasket   -  she seems to be taking a leaf out of your book with her obscenities.
Which obscenities might these be?

Did she go and say 'bum' again, Bashers?

Read the post, and if you don't consider she has used obscenities, then it just says something about your standards.
BA.

Jesus said to him, 的 am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

Shaker

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #62 on: November 14, 2015, 09:58:45 AM »
#52?

Are we talking about the same post? There are no obscenities in it.
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BashfulAnthony

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #63 on: November 14, 2015, 10:03:36 AM »
#52?

Are we talking about the same post? There are no obscenities in it.

I'm referring to "God's Love,"  M37
BA.

Jesus said to him, 的 am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

Shaker

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #64 on: November 14, 2015, 10:06:33 AM »
Nope, didn't see any there either.
Porn gives young people wholly unrealistic ideas about how quickly a plumber will get to your house.

BashfulAnthony

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #65 on: November 14, 2015, 10:09:57 AM »
Nope, didn't see any there either.

Surprise, surprise!
BA.

Jesus said to him, 的 am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

NicholasMarks

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #66 on: November 14, 2015, 10:12:27 AM »
All:

It is very sad when God's words of, great tribulations...wars and rumours of wars...difficult times hard to deal with, come to fruition. Almighty God didn't even spare his son from great atrocities administered by evil but left the redress to be made, exclusively, by resurrection, and my confidence is such that the innocent and the faithful here, and in past events, and future events of this type, will be resurrected.

Floo's initial reaction can serve as a learning curve in these events...we want to hit back and injure those who injure us and this is what is happening on the world stage and why we can confidently say that WW3 is just around the corner.

We can't be entirely sure how these things will unfold and how it will affect us personally but we can be sure that by following the accurate teaching of Jesus Christ we aren't adding to the distress and we have a chance of resurrection, through God's love and Jesus' teaching of righteousness.


Shaker

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #67 on: November 14, 2015, 10:17:50 AM »
Nope, didn't see any there either.

Surprise, surprise!
Well, tell me where you think the obscenity is or obscenities are.
Porn gives young people wholly unrealistic ideas about how quickly a plumber will get to your house.

'andles for forks

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #68 on: November 14, 2015, 10:23:19 AM »
Absolutely spot-on.  I have made this point before.  The atheists on here seem to think that it is the business of this forum to grill theists constantly.
It seems to be the business of theists here to reel out baseless assertions and unsubstantiated claims on a daily basis and not expect to be grilled on them, adding hypocrisy into their toxic mix by demanding evidence from all and sundry yet going into hiding when somebody asks them to justify their assertions. That's not the way it works, and nor should it.

If people post on forums they have to expect their beliefs to be challenged.
Yes..........please start expecting.
I like the ''made up in the fourth century'' hypothesis but I also like Bart Ehrman. There's only one way to sort this out. Use contradictory evidence as it suits your argument wheeeeyyyyy!

Outrider

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #69 on: November 14, 2015, 10:26:02 AM »
If you want to know about Almighty God the best person to ask is Jesus Christ. He portrayed him and told us everything we need to know,...This being that God is the figure-head of all universal knowledge...mainly because he is the living voice of all that energy, all that science, and all that creativity...This is why he is known as an All Knowing God...and why we are invited to share in all that knowledge.

That's lovely, I have a copy of his rather inventive manifesto statement, complete with all the supernatural trimmings, but could you tell me when his constituency hours start? I'd like to talk to him about some his claims, but he doesn't seem to answer...

O.
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Outrider

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #70 on: November 14, 2015, 10:28:57 AM »
The quite staggering repetition of your ignorance is almost beyond description.  You have never read the Bible many times:  if you had you would realise that the love shown by Our Lord shines through.  Shame on you for your deceit!!

It doesn't shine through on us quite as hard as it shone through on Sodom and Gommorah, though, or on the first-born of Egypt, or on the children ripped apart by bears, or on all the occupants of the Earth except Noah and his immediately family, or the 150+ people killed yesterday in Paris.

You see love shining through, I see some nice ideas interspersed with some horrific ones. That people can have different interpretations should not come as surprise; shame on you for an accusation of 'deceit' just because someone doesn't feel as you do.

O.
Universes are forever, not just for creation...

New Atheism - because, apparently, there's a use-by date on unanswered questions.

Eminent Pedant, Interpreter of Heretical Writings, Unwarranted Harvester of Trite Nomenclature, Church of Debatable Saints

'andles for forks

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #71 on: November 14, 2015, 10:29:30 AM »
Absolutely spot-on.  I have made this point before.  The atheists on here seem to think that it is the business of this forum to grill theists constantly.
It seems to be the business of theists here to reel out baseless assertions
I have told you the basis on which I operate. Talk of scientific validation is mere scrabbling about in the toolkit and coming out with 'Empiricism' for a quick fix. Try going the whole hog on empiricism and see where that gets you......of course it's empiricism today, scientism when it suits.

I don't with science here.

Mt disgreements are with the obvious philosophies people dress the science up in....and no ..............philosophies can't be validated.

I like the ''made up in the fourth century'' hypothesis but I also like Bart Ehrman. There's only one way to sort this out. Use contradictory evidence as it suits your argument wheeeeyyyyy!

BashfulAnthony

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #72 on: November 14, 2015, 10:30:35 AM »
Nope, didn't see any there either.

Surprise, surprise!
Well, tell me where you think the obscenity is or obscenities are.

It is obscene to refer to God using that particular word b- word;  even she admitted to being "crude;" referring to God as performing a particular act. I am treading carefully so as not to repeat the actual words, or some clever clogs will say I'm using bad language.
BA.

Jesus said to him, 的 am the way, and the truth, and the life.

It is my commandment that you love one another."

NicholasMarks

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #73 on: November 14, 2015, 10:32:21 AM »
If you want to know about Almighty God the best person to ask is Jesus Christ. He portrayed him and told us everything we need to know,...This being that God is the figure-head of all universal knowledge...mainly because he is the living voice of all that energy, all that science, and all that creativity...This is why he is known as an All Knowing God...and why we are invited to share in all that knowledge.

That's lovely, I have a copy of his rather inventive manifesto statement, complete with all the supernatural trimmings, but could you tell me when his constituency hours start? I'd like to talk to him about some his claims, but he doesn't seem to answer...

O.

Reply #15 covers it adequately Outrider.


'andles for forks

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Re: Ontological Argument.......Really?
« Reply #74 on: November 14, 2015, 10:33:18 AM »
Absolutely spot-on.  I have made this point before.  The atheists on here seem to think that it is the business of this forum to grill theists constantly.
It seems to be the business of theists here to reel out baseless assertions and unsubstantiated claims on a daily basis and not expect to be grilled on them, adding hypocrisy into their toxic mix by demanding evidence from all and sundry yet going into hiding when somebody asks them to justify their assertions. That's not the way it works, and nor should it.

If people post on forums they have to expect their beliefs to be challenged. I make no apology at all for making comments about the Biblical deity, which are not to the taste of some. However, although of course I don't believe it exists, I detest the way some of those that do behave. We have a few posters who have the temerity to call themselves 'Christians' whom Jesus might have been ashamed if he had been a halfway decent person. They slag others off, but have a total inability to see how unpleasant they are! I am repeating myself, a habit my husband frequently points out to me! But I will continue to bang on about the hypocrisy of those who give Christianity a bad name, as it does the Christians who are very good people no favours at all!
Yes you can take the above line.
To me it just shows up the elephant in the room.....Human sin.
I like the ''made up in the fourth century'' hypothesis but I also like Bart Ehrman. There's only one way to sort this out. Use contradictory evidence as it suits your argument wheeeeyyyyy!