Here's The Plan We Should Be Following.

[Nearly Sane]

How on earth can you have a general election to resolve the Brexit issue?

Remain and leave supporters are spread across the parties.

Is one political party going to agree to represent staying in, and the other coming out?

it won't resolve it, it just seems part of the democratic process to me.

[Nearly Sane]

The is only one way to leave and that is to leave. To take back control and leave the EU's political project, which includes the Single Market.

The leave campaign and those in the leave arena were never a homogeneous unit.

Your two paragraphs contradict each other

[Jack Knave]

Vlad, currently, we are not committed to leaving; that commitment can only follow a vote in Parliament and a resultant Act of Parliament.  Until then, the referendum result remains an advisory result.  With such a small majority to leave, I have a few doubts whether Article 50 will ever be triggered.

The is only one way to leave and that is to leave. To take back control and leave the EU's political project, which includes the Single Market.

The leave campaign and those in the leave arena were never a homogeneous unit.

[wigginhall]

I see that Blair is campaigning for a kind of reinterpretation of Brexit.  Oh well, that's probably swung it for a hard Brexit.

[Nearly Sane]

That's not quite what I'm talking about here. I am aware of the idea of the opposition.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jun/29/uk-voted-for-brexit-but-is-there-a-way-back

It's more about some people plotting to disregard the referendum altogether, when the government promised that what the people voted for, they would get.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-loophole-eu-referendum-mps-law-legal-legislation-constitution-a7105181.html

That's not dissent, that's dishonesty.

The reason David Cameron is saying no to some MP s and others suggestions, is because he knows it's dishonesty.

So much so, he can't bring himself to do what the honest approach entails, and has stepped down.

The problem with  your position is that you are saying that someone who opposed Cameron, the referendum and how it was held is somehow being dishonourable for not following promises they didn't make. This was raised when you stated


'Anyone trying to wheedle their way into having a different outcome , is actually behaving dishonourably.'

[Walt Zingmatilder]

The is only one way to leave and that is to leave. To take back control and leave the EU's political project, which includes the Single Market.

The leave campaign and those in the leave arena were never a homogeneous unit.

That as they say is pure political propaganda.
It is highly debatable and to deny that is to stifle debate.
Norway is not in the EU. Therefore you are trying to turdpolish something extra into the plain meaning of leaving the EU.

The referendum was an unthought through crock from the start.
Even Farage recognised that when he said that a 52/48 vote would mean unfinished business.
Given Brexit regret we have the situation where in a few months time any probrexit administration could be undeniably holding a majority against its will, so good luck with that.

[Jack Knave]

sorry, this seems like a non sequitur. Surely whether we should argue for a GE after the new PM emerges and parties can give the clear position on what Brexit should be is not affected by any of the above?

That was not in your post I was replying to.

The issue was the non binding aspect of the referendum and that it would be the government who would then take the reins of its result. Nothing else was proffered.

[Jack Knave]

Your two paragraphs contradict each other

Your capacity to understand is limited, I quit understand.

The first was a 'should' - a moralistic and idealistic position; what should be. The other was just a fact of life.

[Nearly Sane]

Your capacity to understand is limited, I quit understand.

The first was a 'should' - a moralistic and idealistic position; what should be. The other was just a fact of life.

The first was an assertion which was disproved by the fact. It also means that you are saying the result of the referendum was based in what your view is a lie. If you were being morally consistent you would refuse to accept the result.

[Jack Knave]

That as they say is pure political propaganda.
It is highly debatable and to deny that is to stifle debate.
Norway is not in the EU. Therefore you are trying to turdpolish something extra into the plain meaning of leaving the EU.

Wrong, Norway are enmeshed in the EU's political project to a certain degree, ergo it is in the EU arena. Leave means leave; out is out.

[Jack Knave]

The first was an assertion which was disproved by the fact. It also means that you are saying the result of the referendum was based in what your view is a lie. If you were being morally consistent you would refuse to accept the result.

Shock horror politicians catch lying. Never in the world of politics and elections have they ever lied to get into power and then reneged on their promises. That's politics, suck it up!!!

[Nearly Sane]

Shock horror politicians catch lying. Never in the world of politics and elections have they ever lied to get into power and then reneged on their promises. That's politics, suck it up!!!

this isn't about politicians, this is about you. Your position is effectively stating the referendum does not give any mandate for what you believe.

[Jack Knave]

this isn't about politicians, this is about you. Your position is effectively stating the referendum does not give any mandate for what you believe.

I have no idea where you got that from. You are going to have to put a lot more flesh on the bones than that to explain what you are trying to say.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Wrong, Norway are enmeshed in the EU's political project to a certain degree, ergo it is in the EU arena. Leave means leave; out is out.

Norway is not in th EU Jack....that's a fact.
'The EUs political project' was not on the ballot paper. Neither was 'EU arena'.

[ProfessorDavey]

Wrong, Norway are enmeshed in the EU's political project to a certain degree, ergo it is in the EU arena. Leave means leave; out is out.

You really don't get it do you.

The question was whether to remain a member of the EU or alternatively to leave the EU. If we end up like Norway the democratic mandate of the referendum has been fulfilled as we won't be a member of the EU any more, we will have left the EU.

[ProfessorDavey]

I see that Blair is campaigning for a kind of reinterpretation of Brexit.  Oh well, that's probably swung it for a hard Brexit.

Interesting that both Blair and Jack Straw have been higher profile in the last few days than they have been for years - particularly with Chilcott out next week - do you think they know something about the findings of the inquiry that the rest of us don't yet?

[L.A.]

Interesting that both Blair and Jack Straw have been higher profile in the last few days than they have been for years - particularly with Chilcott out next week - do you think they know something about the findings of the inquiry that the rest of us don't yet?

I believe that the excrement/fan impact is scheduled for Wednesday.

[jeremyp]

First of all Nigel and UKIP did see all this outcome as it was talked about months ago on their site. Secondly some official twatish organisation gave the Leave campaign to those wankers Vote.Leave, (not Farage and Leave.EU) so using them as the official stance on the EU is bogus. The whole thing has been a farce, but the outcome of leave will send hope and further referendums across the EU member states.   

Nigel and his ilk have contributed to the current mess. Nigel has dragged the good name of the UK through mud in the EU parliament. He is an embarrassment and the sooner he fucks off the better.

[Bubbles]

Nigel and his ilk have contributed to the current mess. Nigel has dragged the good name of the UK through mud in the EU parliament. He is an embarrassment and the sooner he fucks off the better.

Look at the company he keeps ( note the Union Jack shoes) 

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2016/jul/03/farage-murdoch-lebedev-and-fox-break-bread-as-told-by-lily-allen

Interesting!

I wonder what their agenda is.

[Jack Knave]

Norway is not in th EU Jack....that's a fact.
'The EUs political project' was not on the ballot paper. Neither was 'EU arena'.

Depends on what you mean by the EU. It is effected by its political project and its political rules which imposes itself on it. In my books that makes it in it.

[Jack Knave]

You really don't get it do you.

The question was whether to remain a member of the EU or alternatively to leave the EU. If we end up like Norway the democratic mandate of the referendum has been fulfilled as we won't be a member of the EU any more, we will have left the EU.

Your cognitive dissonance is really tugging at your emotional strings, Davey. Face facts, I'm right on this point.

[Jack Knave]

Nigel and his ilk have contributed to the current mess. Nigel has dragged the good name of the UK through mud in the EU parliament. He is an embarrassment and the sooner he fucks off the better.

That's your biased opinion and way off the mark.

Nigel has be spot on from day one.

[jeremyp]

That's your biased opinion and way off the mark.

Nigel has be spot on from day one.

I see he has taken my advice and fucked off. Nice of him to do that and leave everybody else except Boris to clear up the shit. You must be very proud of the arsehole.

[Jack Knave]

I see he has taken my advice and fucked off. Nice of him to do that and leave everybody else except Boris to clear up the shit. You must be very proud of the arsehole.

Oh dear!!!

Firstly, he is not in power so what do you expect him to do? Secondly, there is talk that he will be playing some kind of advisory role with Leadsom's government, should she win. So he is quite willing to take part in the negotiations in some manner, and as you say, clear up the shit that the EU has imposed on us for the last three decades or so - when Maastricht was introduced.

[Gonnagle]

Dear Jackie Boy,

Well Leadsom is not going to win, to me it looks like May all the way, and now that he has stepped down as the UKIP leader ( his job is done ) could you be a pal and write to him and ask him to stand down as a MEP, after all his job is done

Gonnagle.