Hate crime law: Force for good or recipe for disaster?

[Nearly Sane]

Well intentioned idiocy is my take.


"Then, before ye know it," the subtitled video goes on, "ye've committed a hate crime."


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-68570614

[jeremyp]

"Then, before ye know it," the subtitled video goes on, "ye've committed a hate crime."

I think that actually encapsulates everything that is wrong with the idea of hate crime.

This bit is depressing too.

Police Scotland has pledged to investigate every hate crime complaint it receives, even though last week the force said it would no longer investigate every "low level" crime in Scotland, including some cases of theft.

Which is worse? Somebody saying mean things to you or somebody stealing your stuff?

[Nearly Sane]

I think that actually encapsulates everything that is wrong with the idea of hate crime.

This bit is depressing too.

Which is worse? Somebody saying mean things to you or somebody stealing your stuff?

Maybe people should report thefts, and say the thief left a nasty note?

[Steve H]

Hate crime legislation was a big mistake. It doesn't add any new crimes to the book, it just makes it possible to make the sentence more severe - but crimes such as rape, GBH and murder are very serious crimes in any case, and rightly attract long prison sentences. They do not become even more serious because they were done from motives of religious or racial hatred. It's hard to see what motive other than hate could result  in crimes like that.

[Nearly Sane]

Hate crime legislation was a big mistake. It doesn't add any new crimes to the book, it just makes it possible to make the sentence more severe - but crimes such as rape, GBH and murder are very serious crimes in any case, and rightly attract long prison sentences. They do not become even more serious because they were done from motives of religious or racial hatred. It's hard to see what motive other than hate could result  in crimes like that.

I agree but in this case the specific legislation does add new crimes, well one,  though what exactly it means is going to found out as we go along.

[Nearly Sane]

Some musings on the Act from 2 Solicitor Advocates

https://open.spotify.com/episode/2kQDrGyEx51VFEo8UZtyBW

[Nearly Sane]

And details on the Police Scotland guidance which is quite worrying.


https://archive.fo/sqDxU

[Nearly Sane]

Article from Lucy Hunter Blackburn upon what feels more and more like a black farce waiting to happen.


https://archive.fo/9zclz

[Nearly Sane]

Coruscating article on the embarrassing nonsense of thr Act and the Hate Monster with a devastating quote from Johann Lamont


“The notion that hate is driven by economic disadvantage insults all who support their families and communities despite poverty. And it ignores the hatred exercised by those who are financially secure.”


https://thecritic.co.uk/police-scotland-must-stop-patronising-the-public/

[Nearly Sane]

Now I end up agreeing with Murdo Fraser! The Hate Crime Act is dangerous, if well meaning, idiocy. That Police Scotland are currently recording 'non-crime hate incidents', and that this is an example is a very sad joke.


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13233691/Scots-Torys-police-row-hate-tweet-claim.html

[Nearly Sane]

Jonathan Pie on the Act, which he refers to as a Bill but we're long past that.


https://youtu.be/28eApJT8hDE?si=_oFxM0l0egUbewyY

[jeremyp]

Jonathan Pie on the Act, which he refers to as a Bill but we're long past that.


https://youtu.be/28eApJT8hDE?si=_oFxM0l0egUbewyY

I think he made a mis-step. Just because he wasn't in Scotland doesn't mean he can't be reported for his anti Scotch hate impression - the video is available to be played in Scotland.

[Nearly Sane]

I think he made a mis-step. Just because he wasn't in Scotland doesn't mean he can't be reported for his anti Scotch hate impression - the video is available to be played in Scotland.

I doubt he cares. I suspect he'd like to be reported.

[Steve H]

I think he made a mis-step. Just because he wasn't in Scotland doesn't mean he can't be reported for his anti Scotch hate impression - the video is available to be played in Scotland.

"Anti-Scottish hate crime" my arse! It's a pretty poor show if you can't take the piss out of Scottish, Welsh, Irish and regional English accents! Are we to ban or Bowdlerise 'Henry V' because of Captains Fluellen, Jamy and Macmorris?

[Nearly Sane]

"Anti-Scottish hate crime" my arse! It's a pretty poor show if you can't take the piss out of Scottish, Welsh, Irish and regional English accents! Are we to ban or Bowdlerise 'Henry V' because of Captains Fluellen, Jamy and Macmorris?

Perhaps one might feel a little touch of Police Scotland in the night if one does.

[jeremyp]

"Anti-Scottish hate crime"

Anti-Scotch is what I wrote.

my arse! It's a pretty poor show if you can't take the piss out of Scottish, Welsh, Irish and regional English accents! Are we to ban or Bowdlerise 'Henry V' because of Captains Fluellen, Jamy and Macmorris?

The English, the English, the English are best. I wouldn't give tuppence for all of the rest.

(Flanders and Swan).

[Steve H]

Anti-Scotch is what I wrote.

Good for you. I should have noted and copied. On a forum I used to post on years ago, there was a Scotch bloke who insisted that "Scotch" was only whisky - otherwise it was ""Scottish". I didn't think of it at the time, but I should have reminded him of pancakes, broth, corner, mist, eggs, bonnet peppers and tape.

[Nearly Sane]

More than 3,000 complaints

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-68721208

[jeremyp]

Good for you. I should have noted and copied. On a forum I used to post on years ago, there was a Scotch bloke who insisted that "Scotch" was only whisky - otherwise it was ""Scottish". I didn't think of it at the time, but I should have reminded him of pancakes, broth, corner, mist, eggs, bonnet peppers and tape.

On Youtube, there's a video of Stewart Lee doing a gig in a club in Glasgow in which he constantly talks about "the Scotch" and also "William Wallace Braveheart". It might be the greatest piece of stand-up I've ever seen.

[Nearly Sane]

On Youtube, there's a video of Stewart Lee doing a gig in a club in Glasgow in which he constantly talks about "the Scotch" and also "William Wallace Braveheart". It might be the greatest piece of stand-up I've ever seen.

I was there. It was very funny. Not as funny as Tom O'Connor though, obviously.

[Nearly Sane]

Always a worry when ministers get the law wrong, not sure if it's just ignorance or lying.


https://www.scottishlegal.com/articles/victims-minister-siobhian-brown-repeatedly-gets-new-hate-crime-law-wrong

[Gordon]

Good to see the the Scottish Police Force chief is serious about making apologies when required.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NBGOryiqZZI

[Nearly Sane]

Not entirely sure that it's not hate to describe the complaints as vexatious.


https://talk.tv/top-stories/57049/humza-yousaf-scotland-hate-crime-law-jk-rowling

[jeremyp]

Not entirely sure that it's not hate to describe the complaints as vexatious.


https://talk.tv/top-stories/57049/humza-yousaf-scotland-hate-crime-law-jk-rowling

Being a vexatious git is not a protected characteristic under the new Hate speech law.

[Nearly Sane]

Mandy Rhodes on the Hate Crime Act, JK Rowling, and the idea of the process being the punishment.


https://www.holyrood.com/editors-column/view,jk-rowlings-defence-of-womens-rights-is-what-real-public-service-looks-like