Religion and Ethics Forum
General Category => Sports, Hobbies & Interests => Topic started by: Nearly Sane on December 29, 2017, 11:34:53 AM
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So even before the start of the year we see the trend from last year in the men's game of injuries loom with Nadal and Djokovic both delaying their planned returns and questions being asked about Murray already.
For the women, the undoubted story is the return of Serena Wiliams
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And the questions about Murray were justified. I doubt that he will play much before the French Open.
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Murray, and Nishikori, pulled out of Aus Open. With doubts over Djokovic and Wawrinka, and Raonic's loss to De Minaur looking that he was struggling, you could have the top five ranked players at last year's tournament injured.
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And now Serena has pulled out. Probably not that much of a surprise but a disappointment for the tournament director.
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If this carries on much longer, I'd better dust off my racquet. I think I have a shot at Wimbledon.
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And Djokovic out. An odd set of quarter finalists with a sort of normal service with Federer, Nadal, Dimitrov, Cilic, and Berdych but then three unseeded players with Sandgren being the one no one would have picked to get this far. Given the draw it means one unseeded player in the semi finals. I suppose given Chung's win at the young players end of year tournament his performance is understandable.
That only Kerber is a slam winner amongst the last 16 of the women is I suppose not that surprising but it still feels odd that so many of the contenders for the number 1 ranking haven't won a slam. It looks pretty open and a case could be made for any one left to win.
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Mmm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/42776652
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And an intriguing line up in the semi finals. Federer in his 43rd Slam semi final against Chung who played incredibly against Djokovic, and Cilic who has looked very strong against Edmund who must be pinching himself. You would suspect a Federer Cilic final but both Chung and Edmund will be feeling confident after their last performances.
For the women Kerber has looked the class act but both Halep and Wozniacki have improved through the tournament. The questions remain about their ability to shut out the nerves but both have the game to win. Mertens seems nerveless up to now but to beat Wozniacki and one of Kerber - Halep would be astounding.
That both Nadal and Djokovic have injuries again will beworrying for promoters of upcoming tournaments. Given that, I suspect, neither would have played Davis Cup,they would gave a little recovery time planned anyway but were Federer to do as he did last year and avoid the clay season, and with Murray unlikely to be fit for it, a loss of another of tgd 'Big Four' would surely have an impact.
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So a new winner of a slam for women is guaranteed. Halep's match with Kerber was extraordinary. And yet Wozniacki seems to be playing better than ever.
And odd that the two younger challengers in the men's tourney faltered because of injury. Cilic has been the outstanding player but if Federer wins what words are left, 20 slams, 36, GOAT becomes almost a given.
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We are all rather gloomy following Halep's defeat.
(Well Mrs Bennett is, the rest if us are just going along with the mood)
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Two good finals with the women's being overall more interesting with a last set which could have gone either way. Halep will, if injury free, be a strong chance for the French but will need to be careful not to get worried about having a number of finals where she has come close.
Federer's reaction made me wonder a bit that he might be thinking this could be the last year. The question will whether he might get a chance to get to No.1 in the next few weeks. If Nadal is longer term injured then there is a chance in 5 weeks where Federer has less points to defend before a run of points.
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Is there any doubt that Federer is the greatest player in the men's game there has ever been?
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Is there any doubt that Federer is the greatest player in the men's game there has ever been?
No, I would think. I think the only question that might be raised is his h2h with Nadal, but I don't think that weighs against the overall numbers. There are a couple of outliers in the figures with Jimmy Connors total wins in matches and tournaments but I think that is balanced by it being easier to win tournaments at the time and the lower class of opposition. Note I'm not talking about it being a weak era but the much higher number of matches and wins against top 10 opponents. Federey, Nadal and Djokovic have by far the highest number of matches and wins against the top ten, and Murray is 8th, and all their losses include their records against each other.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_Era_tennis_records_–_men%27s_singles
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No, I would think. I think the only question that might be raised is his h2h with Nadal, but I don't think that weighs against the overall numbers. There are a couple of outliers in the figures with Jimmy Connors total wins in matches and tournaments but I think that is balanced by it being easier to win tournaments at the time and the lower class of opposition. Note I'm not talking about it being a weak era but the much higher number of matches and wins against top 10 opponents. Federey, Nadal and Djokovic have by far the highest number of matches and wins against the top ten, and Murray is 8th, and all their losses include their records against each other.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_Era_tennis_records_–_men%27s_singles
Yep, I will go along with that, the only qualification being the perennial argument about what would Rod Laver have achieved if the rules at the time had been different?
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Yep, I will go along with that, the only qualification being the perennial argument about what would Rod Laver have achieved if the rules at the time had been different?
Effectively that is the issue with any comparison with the pre Open era both for amateur and professional achievements. Arguably had Hoad, Rosewall, Gonzales played on the amateurs at that time he might not have got that. Add to that that 3 of the slams used to be played on grass, not that Laver couldn't play on all surfaces and arguably his record on clay is a stronger one than Federer, and you create more confusion in the difference.
Incidentally, below is a list compiled in 2012 from expert opinions which then places Federer and Laver 1st and 2nd. The main changes I think we might see since then is a rise for Serena Williams, Nadal, Djokovic and an appearance of Murray (whom I would suspect might be rated somewhere in the 40s), and Wawrinka (whom I would think be in the 70s).
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/100_Greatest_of_All_Time
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Thanks for that list.
I am reminded of reading Charlie Buchans Soccer Annual for 1969, in which the England team of 1939 were hypothetically pitted against the England team of 1968, the conclusion being that only Tommy Lawton would have seriously troubled the 1968 team.
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So Federer playing in Rotterdam has chance to reach No.1 if he reaches the quarter finals.
And Serena Williams returned to competition in the Fed Cup
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Edmund withdrawing from the Argentine Open means Murray will remain UK No. 1 for now. Though that will change in March. Nor sure when that was last the case.
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So slight miscalculation, Federer needs to get to the semi final to get the No.1_spot back so one more match.
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And he won
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And won in the final too.
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Good tournament win at Delray Beach for Francis Tiafoe, Could well be a sign that he's kicked on from last year and could challenge in higher ranked tournaments.
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Nadal pulled out of the Mexican Open with recurrence of injury- if that extends into the clay season, he has a lot of points to defend.
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Both Nadal and Wawrinka out of Miami and Indian Wells. Not going to be easy to come back to clay, if not fully fit
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And Kyle Edmund is British No. 1. First time since 2006 that it isn't Murray
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So Indian Wells will have amongst the unseeded players, Serene Williams, Azarenka, and Sharapove,
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And Sharapova out.
Federer needs to reach the semi final to maintain his No. 1 ranking due to dropping the points from last year's win next week. He would need a similar result in Miami, unless he gets to the wins or gets to the final here to maintain that position. After that focus would switch to the clay court season where Nadal has a mammoth amount of points to defend and Federer has none. I suspect that he will again pass the clay court season though one wonders if an appearance at the French might happen
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And a win for Serena on her return.
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I can see the logic with Billie Jean King's proposal here to reduce the sets men play in GS. I suspect that there will ne some push back from tradition. While I find long matches enthralling, when it gets to past 4 hrs, you do have to wonder if that is likely to lead to injuries. That Federer and Nadal are 1 and 2 in the world though does argue against that this is worse than previously.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/43337914
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Been some interesting results, the match up between Serena and Venus, that Venus won, the victories of Coric and Chung, again indicating a breakthrough of the younger generation, but pegged back by Alex Zverev's loss.
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Surprised that Cilic lost, with Nadal, Murray, and Wawrinka injured, Djokovic's loss, the marquee names are gone. Now Cilic, Dimitrov, Alex Zverev, and Them all knocked out the higher seeds other than Federer are all gone. And there is an odd mix of young and old left in.
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A final between Osaka and Kasatkina, both 20 years old., and both had a hard road to the final, Kasatkina in particular. It will be interesting to see to f tgisis a genuine emergence of consistent contenders.
meanwhile one of those in the men's game who looked like the real thing bit has then not kicked on, Coric, has made the semifinal.
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Very tense semi final with Coric vs Federer going down to word, advantage Coric.
And Federer just broken back 4-4 final set
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And Federer wins it 6-4!
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Massive final win for Del Potro in great match. And congratulations to Osaka for a huge move up in in class.
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Interesting argument from James Blake.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/43464868
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A last 16 in the Masters with none of the 'Big Four, when did that last happen? And Federer dropping fron the No. 1 spot! Though Nadal has a lot of points to defend in the clay court season but is selected for Davis Cup.
And you might have bet the house, your mother's house and that piece of blue blue cheese you have been saving on Venus Williams vs Collins but it would be gone!
Still given the issues Azarenka has had, go Azza!
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I heard an item on Five Live last night about a man (from the midlands I'd say) who has announced that he is going to train his daughters to become the best women players ever. There was a child psychologist, what'sis name Fuller )who does the ~BBC commentating), The Murrays' Mum and Navratilova. The older girl is now 9 and the father and his Australian wife moved to Florida (I think that's right) to continue her training. The younger girl is about 3 and will begin her training next year. Apart from the fact that in my opinion no parent should ever control a child's life like that, the father is apparently going to make his right-handed younger daughter learn to play left-handed. He also intends to move the family to Spain next year. A reporter who has been following the story from the start, and who remained impartial in his comments on the programme, said they were first living in Melbourne. The father seems to have a couple of businesses.
The whole thing sounds horrendous to me.
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This is the story
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/43486837
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NS
Thank you for the link. I'll look at it later. What is your opinion of the parents' plan?
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I heard an item on Five Live last night about a man (from the midlands I'd say) who has announced that he is going to train his daughters to become the best women players ever. There was a child psychologist, what'sis name Fuller )who does the ~BBC commentating), The Murrays' Mum and Navratilova. The older girl is now 9 and the father and his Australian wife moved to Florida (I think that's right) to continue her training. The younger girl is about 3 and will begin her training next year. Apart from the fact that in my opinion no parent should ever control a child's life like that, the father is apparently going to make his right-handed younger daughter learn to play left-handed. He also intends to move the family to Spain next year. A reporter who has been following the story from the start, and who remained impartial in his comments on the programme, said they were first living in Melbourne. The father seems to have a couple of businesses.
The whole thing sounds horrendous to me.
Yes, I agree with you on this one. Teaching a right-handed child to play tennis with their left-hand is totally irresponsible. This could actually affect their speech and cause them to start stammering. It's so sad when parents go to these extreme lengths to really satisfy their own desires.
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So a win for Isner and Stephens - would have been good odds on those at the start of the tournament. Zverev is still the most likely looking new (i.e. Not previously held it) World No 1.
And now this week Nadal returns in the Davis Cup.
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Fascinating match between Djokovic, returning from injury and looking good, against Thiem in Monte Carlo this afternoon.
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So Thiem got through the in 3 sets not to be demolished by Nadal for the loss of 2 games. Another triumphant season in clay seems likely for the greatest clay court player of all time. Normally I would have an 'arguably' in there but I think the case for Nadal on clay is now unarguable.
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And Nadal cruised to the win - 36 straight sets won on clay.
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Bad loss for Djokovic in Barcelona.
And Sharapova dropping out of the top fifty - you wonder how if it's that far till she retires.
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Bad loss for Djokovic in Barcelona.
And Sharapova dropping out of the top fifty - you wonder how if it's that far till she retires.
What do you think 'andy Murray is likely to do? Have you been following his progress at all?
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I heard an item on Five Live last night about a man (from the midlands I'd say) who has announced that he is going to train his daughters to become the best women players ever. There was a child psychologist, what'sis name Fuller )who does the ~BBC commentating), The Murrays' Mum and Navratilova. The older girl is now 9 and the father and his Australian wife moved to Florida (I think that's right) to continue her training. The younger girl is about 3 and will begin her training next year. Apart from the fact that in my opinion no parent should ever control a child's life like that, the father is apparently going to make his right-handed younger daughter learn to play left-handed. He also intends to move the family to Spain next year. A reporter who has been following the story from the start, and who remained impartial in his comments on the programme, said they were first living in Melbourne. The father seems to have a couple of businesses.
The whole thing sounds horrendous to me.
There's a serious danger that the girls will hit their teens and decide they are sick of tennis and don't want to have anything more to do with it. Well, I say danger, it's more a hope.
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What do you think 'andy Murray is likely to do? Have you been following his progress at all?
At some stage a 'comeback' but I think the odds are not necessarily in his favour. It was a serious op, and despite both Nadal's and Federer's returns, it isn't by any means a given. Not looking good either at this stage for Wawrinka.
Fascinating to see Zverev win last week, but he has to do it a slam. Good to see Shapovalov continuing to improve though Nadal a step too far today.
No one quite emerging in the women's game at moment. Halep playing well but then Kvitova not playing this week. Serena couldn't return at the French and win it?
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At some stage a 'comeback' but I think the odds are not necessarily in his favour. It was a serious op, and despite both Nadal's and Federer's returns, it isn't by any means a given. Not looking good either at this stage for Wawrinka.
Fascinating to see Zverev win last week, but he has to do it a slam. Good to see Shapovalov continuing to improve though Nadal a step too far today.
No one quite emerging in the women's game at moment. Halep playing well but then Kvitova not playing this week. Serena couldn't return at the French and win it?
Thank you. Were the details of ~Andy Murray's operation available to read on the internet?
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Thank you. Were the details of ~Andy Murray's operation available to read on the internet?
Not really, unsurprisingly. But the link covers some details.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/tennis/2018/01/08/andy-murray-undergoes-hip-surgery-australia-remains-hopeful/
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Some great match ups in the semi finals. Sharapova v Halep and Nadal v Djokovic amongst others
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We never won the Tour de France until 2012, when Wiggo became the first British winner, and since then, we've won it in every year except 2014, and Chris Froome, who won in 2013 and 2015-17 is now one of the all-time great Tour riders. No Briton won the Men's Singles at Wimbledon since Fred Perry in the 30s, and now Andy Murray sweeps all before him. Max Whitlock became the first-ever UK man to win an Olympic gold in gymanstics (a local lad to me, brought up in Hemel Hempstead).
What is the UK suddenly doing right in the sports world?
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Nadal back to No1 Ranking
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Serena vs Shazza in the 4th round, go Serena!
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Big win for Zverev to get to quarter final of a Slam for first time. Youngest quarter finalist at Roland Garros since Del Potro in 2009.
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And Serena pulls out injured - from the sounds of it, could be a significant injury. Be sad if this was the end of career
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Intriguing match up between Thiem and Zverev, probably the two most likely to stop Nadal winning (With Djokovic still needing to look at his best) and both yet to live up to their potential at slams. A once most likely to succeed against the current most likely. Zverev has been gutsy so far but will the five set matches the their toll on a player who isn't renowned for their endurance?
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And an easy win for Thiem with Zverev struggling with injury. Djokovic in the following match seems also to be having problems, and with Serena's withdrawal yesterday, added to all the ongoing injuries and recoveries, it's a sort of subdued last couple of days.
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Amazing win for Cecchinato. And today Muguruza v Sharapova, two previous winners and No 1s, and Halep, still to win a Slam but No1 v Kerber, a former No1.
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Easy win for Muguruza, but tough fight for Halep. Nadal's match very tough so far, and the Cilic Del Porto match intriguing between the only people in 13 years to win a Slam outside of Federer, Nadal, Djokovic, Murray and Wawrinka.
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Schwartzman wins first set -first set Nadal has lost in 38 at Roland Garros
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Big win for Halep.
And Nadal keeps doing the unimaginable
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So Andy Murray to play next week at Queens.
And if Federer wins today he will be back to No1
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And Federer back at No 1 making a new record for oldest ever
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Have you seen any film of Andy Murray playing? If so, how does he look?
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Nothing yet, my suspicion is this is a risk.
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Both Thiem and Zverev knocked out in Halle. Federer needs to win it to stay at no 1.
Murray did well but still unsure about Wimbledon.
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Federer into final. Were he to win it, he would, as already noted, remain at number 1. It would also be his 99th tour title. And Wimbledon would be the next tournament.
Nadal likely to get the number 1 ranking back with a good run at Wimbledon.
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Big win for Coric, maybe starting to fulfil the potential.
And Kvitova looking good.
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Murray playing Wawrinka at Eastbourne, both unseeded
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A rating of the best players of the Open era.
http://www.tennis.com/tags/50-greatest-players-open-era/
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Murray wins but the limp still appears to be there.
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And Wimbledon seeds Serena. My sympathies are with Cibulkova here. To be honest I think Wimbledon shouldn't be the only place that doesn't stick to the official rankings.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/44627489
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And Wimbledon seeds Serena. My sympathies are with Cibulkova here. To be honest I think Wimbledon shouldn't be the only place that doesn't stick to the official rankings.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/44627489
Agree. Poor decision.
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After his Wimbledon points from of at the end of the tournament Murray will be world number 831, and British 22.
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So the youngest quarter finalist in the men's at The Wimbledon is 27. By that age Borg had retired.
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And even with Federer going out, all the semi finalists are over 30, not sure when that last happened in a slam.
Odd that given the top ten seeds being knocked out that the women's semifinalists didn't feel shocks.
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So Kerber Vs Williams - both finals will be contested with players over 30.
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Rojer/Schuurs v Azarenka/Murray is a joy to watch
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The Isner Anderson match has a combined height of the players of 13'6'
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What a match! Huge determination but I think that underlines that some form of restriction on a final set makes sense.
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What a match! Huge determination but I think that underlines that some form of restriction on a final set makes sense.
Yes it must make the winner of the match, in this case, Anderson so tired for the final. They have in effect played the equivalent of 2 long matches. Perhaps they should allow the final set up to a pre-determined level, say 10 all, and then move to tie break. Although Nadal and Djokovic are looking as if they are going to go some distance too!
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Yes it must make the winner of the match, in this case, Anderson so tired for the final. They have in effect played the equivalent of 2 long matches. Perhaps they should allow the final set up to a pre-determined level, say 10 all, and then move to tie break. Although Nadal and Djokovic are looking as if they are going to go some distance too!
Yes, I think some sort of extended 5th set makes sense but Anderson has now played 74 games in the last sets of his last 2 matches.
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Who won in Jokavic and Nadal match?
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Who won in Jokavic and Nadal match?
No one so far. Play was suspended with Djokovic 2 sets to 1 up. Resumes at 1pm
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No one so far. Play was suspended with Djokovic 2 sets to 1 up. Resumes at 1pm
Ah, thank you I'll turn on later.
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Ah, thank you I'll turn on later.
Already hugely dramatic.
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Just wow! That is up there in best matches.
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Djokovic's son is the absolute image of his father.
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British No1 Kyle Edmund beaten by World No. 832.
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British No1 Kyle Edmund beaten by World No. 832.
I must admit I doubted whether he’d come back.
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British No1 Kyle Edmund beaten by World No. 832.
Top English tennis player beaten by plucky underdog Scot.
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Top English tennis player beaten by plucky underdog Scot.
:D
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Zverev triumphs in the battle of new stars beating De Minaur, but elsewhere the 30 year olds triumph with Buzarnescu, Kuznetsova and Fognini.
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Tsitsipas follows up win over Djokovic by defeating Zverev. Big week for him.
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And into the final for Tsitsipas - great series of wins to get beating 4 too ten ranked players.
Interesting match up in Women's final with rerun of French Open final.
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Wins for Halep and Nadal, onto Cincinnati
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So Cincinnati gives us the 46th meeting of Djokovic v Federer as the old guard roadshow continues.
Halep returns in the women's final, consolidating her No 1 status, this time against the improving Bertens.
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And a win for Djokovic making him the first since the ATP Masters 1000 series was set up to win all 9.
Big win for Bertens in the WTA tournament.
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Djokovic v Federer possible quarter final at U.S. Open. And given the 1, 2 seedings Nadal Federer can only meet in the final, a match up that has never happened at Flushing Meadow.
Williams sisters seeded to meet in third round.
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Halep out first round. Big shock!
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And a farewell to Slams by Ferrer. I would think this is going to be one of a number in the next couple of years. Federer might be thinking of lasting till Tokyo though next year might be a farewell tour. but we may have seen the last of Karlovic, the Bryans will likely go, Verdasco and Lopez I think, Gasquet and maybe Tsonga and Monfils at the French? And I think any significant injury to Murray, Nadal, Djokovic. and Wawrinka would be the last one.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/45327854
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Nice story on those players for whom this is their last Slam. Just to note that it was written before Benneteau lost to Struff yesterday
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/29/sports/tennis/mikhail-youzhny-david-ferrer-us-open.html
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Never seen anything like this from an umpire.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/45363541
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Never seen anything like this from an umpire.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/45363541
From what I've heard, I think that he should not have stepped out of his role as umpire, but I do not feellll strongly about it .
What is your opinion of Andy Murray's opponent talking to his coach? Obviously, it made no difference to the result, but I think it is a shame these things happen.
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From what I've heard, I think that he should not have stepped out of his role as umpire, but I do not feellll strongly about it .
What is your opinion of Andy Murray's opponent talking to his coach? Obviously, it made no difference to the result, but I think it is a shame these things happen.
If there are rules that are there for this then I think the Verdasco incident should at least be looked at. It may well be that nothing substantial happened.
The Kyrgios incident seems much more worrying. First of all the course of the match changed, and secondly Herbert had a real reason during a substantial part of the match to think that the supposedly disinterested official is supporting Kyrgios.
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If there are rules that are there for this then I think the Verdasco incident should at least be looked at. It may well be that nothing substantial happened.
The Kyrgios incident seems much more worrying. First of all the course of the match changed, and secondly Herbert had a real reason during a substantial part of the match to think that the supposedly disinterested official is supporting Kyrgios.
Yes, perhaps he has a right to demand a replay of the whole match.
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Yes, perhaps he has a right to demand a replay of the whole match.
I can sort of understand the umpire, if he wasn't an umpire. Kyrgios is one of the most naturally talented players I have ever seen, and the public paying for tickets do deserve in a sense to see him at his best. So from the good of the tennis in the day, I can see what the umpire thought. It's just hugely bad for the match, and the umpire as an authority figure and tennis as a sport.
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And now Serena...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/45462014
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And now Serena...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/45462014
Yes, and I don't have a lot of sympathy for her. One of those rare moments where I agree with MSM: that the 'new to the tennis scene' winner of the final was completely overshadowed by Serena's antics.
….. and I like Serena.. :'(
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Yes, and I don't have a lot of sympathy for her. One of those rare moments where I agree with MSM: that the 'new to the tennis scene' winner of the final was completely overshadowed by Serena's antics.
….. and I like Serena.. :'(
The problem is the lack of consistency. The umpire was well within his rights; Williams has a point when she says that the rules aren't applied consistently.
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This is astonishing.
https://www.theguardian.com/media/2018/sep/11/repugnant-racist-news-corp-cartoon-serena-williams-mark-knight
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This is astonishing.
https://www.theguardian.com/media/2018/sep/11/repugnant-racist-news-corp-cartoon-serena-williams-mark-knight
It's a caricature of Serena. He did an equally unflattering cartoon of Kyrgios (white male) a couple of days ago. Not everything is about racism or sexism.
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It's a caricature of Serena. He did an equally unflattering cartoon of Kyrgios (white male) a couple of days ago. Not everything is about racism or sexism.
Well you could argue that. Til you see how he pictures Osaka.
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Well you could argue that. Til you see how he pictures Osaka.
He clearly didn't do his research.
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He clearly didn't do his research.
So he drew a caricature of a black woman having a tantrum based on a match he didn’t see and assumed her opponent wouldn’t also be brown. Either that or he’s playing up Setena’s blackness by portraying her opponent as blonde.
A lot of sexism is unconscious anyway. You felt the need to explain to me who Kyrgios is. I doubt you would in a reply to NS. You’d assume he’d know.
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Yes, at best it gives an unconsciously racist and sexist caricature. But, you would think anyone over the age of 15 could look at the cartoon and see that.
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Interesting comments here.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/11/world/australia/serena-williams-cartoon-herald-sun-racist.html
By the way the cartoonist talks about watching the match. And still he chose to portray Osaka as white and blonde.
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So he drew a caricature of a black woman having a tantrum based on a match he didn’t see and assumed her opponent wouldn’t also be brown. Either that or he’s playing up Setena’s blackness by portraying her opponent as blonde.
Have you seen the Women's tennis tour? A disproportionate number of the players are white. Maybe the other player was not meant to be Naomi Osaka but some generic female tennis player. If so, it was a misstep but should it be the lynching offence that people seem to be implying?
A lot of sexism is unconscious anyway. You felt the need to explain to me who Kyrgios is. I doubt you would in a reply to NS. You’d assume he’d know.
I did not explain to you who Kyrgios is, I placed a description of his appearance and sex after his name to emphasise the fact that the cartoon was a caricature of somebody who is neither black nor a woman.
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Have you seen the Women's tennis tour? A disproportionate number of the players are white. Maybe the other player was not meant to be Naomi Osaka but some generic female tennis player. If so, it was a misstep but should it be the lynching offence that people seem to be implying?
I did not explain to you who Kyrgios is, I placed a description of his appearance and sex after his name to emphasise the fact that the cartoon was a caricature of somebody who is neither black nor a woman.
It’s not often I see a post that really should stand without further comment. This is one.
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I watched the final. I thought what happened was a shame, because Osaka was from the off the better player by far and fully deserved to win. Whether Serena had a point or not I really can't say, because I don't watch that much tennis. I do think the same rules should apply to both the men and women though.
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I watched the final. I thought what happened was a shame, because Osaka was from the off the better player by far and fully deserved to win. Whether Serena had a point or not I really can't say, because I don't watch that much tennis. I do think the same rules should apply to both the men and women though.
I agree. The coaching thing is a nonsense. I'm not sure that bad umpiring is divided along lines of either race or gender though. Some decisions clearly are, but others...it just seems like inconsistency.
It was so sad to see Osaka crying after the match. Whether she intended it or not, Williams ended up winding the audience up in her favour. I do believe she was sincere in trying to calm things once she herself was calm. I thought she seemed angry rather than petulant, but I'm not sure that the umpire was the accurate target for her rage
Osaka is in the ascendency and we will see so much more from her.
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I do think the same rules should apply to both the men and women though.
The rules are the same for both the mens' game and the women's game: no coaching. The issue here is whether the umpires are applying the rules fairly. This and the Kyrgios incident suggest perhaps not.
I think Serena got what she deserved. There were several incidents including racquet abuse and calling the umpire a liar. I think her punishment was totally fair. The problem is do men get away with similar behaviour? If they do, clearly they shouldn't.
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The rules are the same for both the mens' game and the women's game: no coaching. The issue here is whether the umpires are applying the rules fairly. This and the Kyrgios incident suggest perhaps not.
I think Serena got what she deserved. There were several incidents including racquet abuse and calling the umpire a liar. I think her punishment was totally fair. The problem is do men get away with similar behaviour? If they do, clearly they shouldn't.
I think the rules are the same in the Slams - no coaching. But the WTA does allow limited coaching in tournament matches. That I think is where some of the confusion lies. For a coach of a female player it could almost be habit.
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There's a bit more here.
http://www.espn.co.uk/tennis/story/_/id/24618866/us-open-tennis-no-coaching-rule-grand-slam-tennis-let-change-it
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Interesting comments here.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/11/world/australia/serena-williams-cartoon-herald-sun-racist.html
By the way the cartoonist talks about watching the match. And still he chose to portray Osaka as white and blonde.
Quote from Rod Liddle in the Spectator:
"I have spent the morning trying to draw a cartoon of a black person without it being racist. It’s bloody difficult. Especially the lips."
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Quote from Rod Liddle in the Spectator:
"I have spent the morning trying to draw a cartoon of a black person without it being racist. It’s bloody difficult. Especially the lips."
Did he manage to draw a Haitian/Japanese woman without making her look blonde and white?
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Did he manage to draw a Haitian/Japanese woman without making her look blonde and white?
I don't know. I didn't read beyond the quote. I just kept wondering what if it read
"I have spent the morning trying to draw a cartoon of a Jewish person without it being racist. It’s bloody difficult. Especially the nose."
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I don't know. I didn't read beyond the quote. I just kept wondering what if it read
"I have spent the morning trying to draw a cartoon of a Jewish person without it being racist. It’s bloody difficult. Especially the nose."
Jeremy Corbyn would have said that it was a factual description of noses and everyone has one.
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I don't know. I didn't read beyond the quote. I just kept wondering what if it read
"I have spent the morning trying to draw a cartoon of a Jewish person without it being racist. It’s bloody difficult. Especially the nose."
Ultimately he's a wanker and the Spectator have a choice as the whether or not they want to keep employing him or not.
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Ultimately he's a wanker and the Spectator have a choice as the whether or not they want to keep employing him or not.
It's part of The Spectator's marketing brand which is currently sadly succesaful. Basically it's built around a set of clickbait like Breitbart in a moderately well cut suit. Liddle runs his schtick as a contrarian man who speaks his mind, which unsurprisingly leads to a lot of shallow articles. I used to read it quite frequently as while I disagreed with it in the main, it wasn't filled with the end of the pier stuff if you just skipped over Taki's misogynist Nazi ravings.
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With no points to defend in the last tournaments a good run by Djokovic should mean that he would be year end no 1.
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Halep has a slipped disc but a good lead in the women's rankings. Osaka continues to climb the rankings - up to provisional no 4. And Sabalenka looks like the next player to emerge into the mainstream.
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Djokovic maintains his move on the No1 end of year. Big chance for Coric to make a move on being in Year End Championships if he can beat Federer tomorrow.
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Djokovic now only 35 points behind Nadal in ATP race. But looks like Del Potro out for the rest of year.
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Interesting news from Wimbledon
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/45913728
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First ATP your event for Edmund and Tsitsipas. The other ATP event being won by Kachanov,which makes Edmund at 23 the oldest of the three winners this week. Not sure of the last time that would have been true with 3 tournaments.
Women's end of year tournament started and can't see an obvious winner.
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Below the ATP main tour events, last week Ivo Karlovic won a Challenger event and set a new record for the oldest winner of Challenger event at 39 years and 7 months. Suspect that we might see the 'giant' next year.
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Svitolina wins in the year end. Not a shock but not expected either.
Federer wins his 99th tournament, and Anderson wins in Vienna as the over 30 brigade strike back.
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Edmund pulls out of Paris with injury. Undoubtedly a breakthrough year, but needs to back it up, and has a lot of points to defend in Australia.
Although it's been a good year for a number of younger players, it looks like the year end in London will have only one player, Zverev, under 25. And though he has had a great year, as yet it still looks as if he hasn't quite been consistent enough, especially in Slams, to be seen as part of the elite. Next year needs to see him, along with Tsitsipas, Tiafoe, and De Minaur amongst others, get to finals in slams, and look to be consistently ranked in the top ten, and top 3 for Zverev to have a new generation of stars.
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Lots of new stars in the women's game. And some such as Wozniacki and Halep winning that first Slam after many years where they were expected to. And yet with Osaka's dip in form, injury to Halep, and Wozniacki being diagnosed with arthritis, next year feels, as with this year all about Serena.
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Nadal out in Paris with injury, which means that Djokovic will be number 1 on Monday. If Nadal doesn't make the yearend then Djokovic could have a big points lead at the end of the year.
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And Nadal pulls out of the year end, which guarantees Djokovic his 5th end of year Number 1 ranking. If Djokovic does well then he is likely to remain World No 1 until at the very least Wimbledon. A good year next for him and will be closing in on Federer's 302 weeks at the top.
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The year end then gave us a win for Zverev. If he can get his act together in terms of the Slams, then it's going to be a new No1 at the end of the next year. He seems to have the all court game. Were he to win in Australia then he would be younger than Federer was when he won his first slam.