Religion and Ethics Forum
General Category => Politics & Current Affairs => Topic started by: Nearly Sane on March 27, 2016, 07:58:57 PM
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In a city with a long history of religious sectarian violence, this has been depressing. It now appears that the person arrested may have driven up from Bradford to stab someone for believing in the same god, but differently.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-35904406
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I've been following this story over the past few days with a deep sadness. There just aren't the words.
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One of my friends used the shop frequently. Says Mr Shah was a happy gentle soul whom the community loved.
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I hope they catch the callous bastard who did this and lock him up for life.
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I hope they catch the callous bastard who did this and lock him up for life.
Yes so do I, they have arrested some one.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-35898543
They seem to not be releasing much info.
I read somewhere that he was an ahmadiyya ( the shopkeeper )
They are quite liberal, as he appears to have been. (. Liberal as in friendly to other faiths etc)
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We will have to wait and see the details but currently it may be his liberal approach that was the issue
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/police-believe-asad-shah-killer-7636748
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One of the more depressing stories I've read in quite a while :(
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We will have to wait and see the details but currently it may be his liberal approach that was the issue
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/police-believe-asad-shah-killer-7636748
Interestingly it says
"A man, 32, arrested in connection with the killing could not appear in court yesterday because he was recovering from injuries in hospital.
He is now expected to appear at Glasgow Sheriff Court on Tuesday."
I wonder what happened to him?
Hmmmm! Perhaps someone disapproved and clocked him one.
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In a city with a long history of religious sectarian violence, this has been depressing. It now appears that the person arrested may have driven up from Bradford to stab someone for believing in the same god, but differently.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-35904406
If that is true then we are looking at ISIS inspired people, I would of thought......?
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If that is true then we are looking at ISIS inspired people, I would of thought......?
Are we? Who knows? Are you suggesting that there was no such violence pre ISIS?
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Are we? Who knows? Are you suggesting that there was no such violence pre ISIS?
The "I would of thought....?" casts some doubt into what I had said on my part.
I don't know. But if it was due to a different perspective of the Muslim religion then ISIS type inspired ideas would be a possibility.
What I am suggesting is that before it was attacks on society generally, on British life. This is Muslim on Muslim, is it not?, which I have not come across before here in the UK - have you or anybody else?
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So if you haven't come across it, how can you suggest the cause?
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He was an ahmadiyya , hence considered a heretic or apostate by most Muslims. They have been persecuted in Pakistan for decades, well before any of the current terrorist groups were around.
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Dear Jack,
What I am suggesting is that before it was attacks on society generally, on British life. This is Muslim on Muslim, is it not?, which I have not come across before here in the UK - have you or anybody else?
It still is, it is not them and us, it is just us.
Gonnagle.
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So if you haven't come across it, how can you suggest the cause?
Because that is what ISIS is doing in Iraq and Syria. They see Muslims who do not follow their brand of Islam as an abomination to Allah and must die. Those who have joined their cause here in the UK would naturally take on a similar attitude. So there is the possibility that this killing was inspired from this.
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Dear Jack,
It still is, it is not them and us, it is just us.
Gonnagle.
No, Gonny, that is just bland crap. To deny that there are groups and classes and sub-sets etc. is to be blind to the reality of life and mankind's psychology and nature. If you don't look at life in its true form it will come back and bit you. This naïve attitude is what makes people go into lion cages to give the beast a loving hug.
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No, Gonny, that is just bland crap. To deny that there are groups and classes and sub-sets etc. is to be blind to the reality of life and mankind's psychology and nature. If you don't look at life in its true form it will come back and bit you. This naïve attitude is what makes people go into lion cages to give the beast a loving hug.
And it is precisely the declaring of such subsets that leads to the stabbing.
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And it is precisely the declaring of such subsets that leads to the stabbing.
Oh dear. The sub-set and what not are not consciously and intellectually demarcated they are an instinctual and for a large portion unconscious process. This Leftie, Marxist idea that people can be programmed to be docile non-judgemental beings is just laughable. ;D
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Oh dear. The sub-set and what not are not consciously and intellectually demarcated they are an instinctual and for a large portion unconscious process. This Leftie, Marxist idea that people can be programmed to be docile non-judgemental beings is just laughable. ;D
My, what a shiny mirror!
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There are more "sub-sets" in the country than there has ever been. The country is becoming more fragmented because of this.
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There are more "sub-sets" in the country than there has ever been. The country is becoming more fragmented because of this.
And is a unified country necessarily a good thing? There are few 'sub sets' in North Korea.
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If unified means people don't despise another to the point of stabbing a complete stranger because of a frankly laughable religious belief then yes, I think a unified country is a good thing.
This is in part why that poor bloke died - look at the one from "Dilly" Hussain
https://twitter.com/cemb_forum/status/648047580090396672
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If unified means people don't despise another to the point of stabbing a complete stranger because of a frankly laughable religious belief then yes, I think a unified country is a good thing.
This is in part why that poor bloke died - look at the one from "Dilly" Hussain
https://twitter.com/cemb_forum/status/648047580090396672
But does unified mean that? Seems to me you are just circularly saying you would like people not to be stabbed, which I agree with, and then saying that a unified country would not have this because you have defined a unified country as one that doesn't have such stabbings. It seems incredibly circular.
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I did not say stabbings would never happen, however it is my opinion where there is more division there could well be a tendancy for less tolerence.
Did you see the intolerence in the tweet? I am sure we had enough of our own, which as a nation we were starting to get over, before we imported that.
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I did not say stabbings would never happen, however it is my opinion where there is more division there could well be a tendancy for less tolerence.
Did you see the intolerence in the tweet? I am sure we had enough of our own, which as a nation we were starting to get over, before we imported that.
So a country that tolerates no disagreement which is what you seem to propose is tolerant. There was this bloke that wrote of this type of attitude, wrote under the name Orwell, perhaps you've heard of him?
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I dont get your first sentence.
Why did you name your thread new sectarianism?
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So a country that tolerates no disagreement which is what you seem to propose is tolerant. There was this bloke that wrote of this type of attitude, wrote under the name Orwell, perhaps you've heard of him?
Disagreement is one thing, stabbing people is another.
When groups of people start encouraging violence against other groups, it doesn't make it a comfortable place to be.
Tolerant is what the victim was, as far as we know, he got stabbed because of it.
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Apparently there is now a Facebook page celebrating his death and congratulating all Muslims
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3513888/Facebook-page-posts-Congratulations-Muslims-message-peace-loving-Islamic-shopkeeper-stabbed-death.html
This country needs to stamp down very hard on this sort of thing stabbing someone is not acceptable, nor is posting sick Facebook messages.
The sort of people that do this, don't want tolerance, they want to stir up a war.
We need to track them down and deal with them harshly.
They are trouble makers, in society. ( sharia law I think also deals harshly with this)
It's not about the wider group they belong to, and suppressing that, but suppressing the individuals that stir up trouble.
I'm appalled that someone can be stabbed because they are tolerant of others and even more appalled someone would put up a Facebook page celebrating their murder.
None of that is acceptable to me.
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Apparently the Facebook page was created by a group called
The Tahaffuz Khatme Nubuwwat movement is a community section which believes Ahmadis are blasphemers. It was born in Pakistan and says it aims to unite Muslims around the world.
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3513888/Facebook-page-posts-Congratulations-Muslims-message-peace-loving-Islamic-shopkeeper-stabbed-death.html#ixzz44M5jEWgF
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
If they are responsible for stirring this up or that Facebook page they should be added to the long list of terrorist groups not permitted in the uk.
They have a headquarters in London according to the report.
I'd get rid of that for a start, send them ( the group headquarters) packing back to Pakistan and ban the group from the uk.
Trouble makers IMO.
We need to send some parts of the world a clear message, this sort of behaviour isn't acceptable in the uk and any group that encourages discord between different groups is not welcome here.
Freedom of speech does not include the right to stab someone and set up a Facebook page celebrating it.
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This next report goes back to 2010 but highlights the hatred this group has stirred up in London alone.
http://www.yourlocalguardian.co.uk/news/local/wimbledonnews/8451429.Hate_campaign_discovered_against_Islamic_minority/
We don't need the headquarters based in London, if it was up to me, I'd send it packing.
It's nothing but trouble.
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There are more "sub-sets" in the country than there has ever been. The country is becoming more fragmented because of this.
And that's because of multiculturalism and the stupid Leftie project that has swamped this country full of foreign incompatible cultures.
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And is a unified country necessarily a good thing? There are few 'sub sets' in North Korea.
How would you know? Anyway that's a stupid argument!
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And that's because of multiculturalism and the stupid Leftie project that has swamped this country full of foreign incompatible cultures.
Leftie [sic] seems to be your favourite snarl word of choice for whatever it is that you don't like.
Labour have been in power for 32/33 years of the 92 years since they first came to power in 1924. Otherwise it's been a coalition of one sort or another on two occasions (National Government1940-45; Tories and LibDems 2010-15; ten years in total) or the Tories outright.
Perhaps you need to drop the mindless slogans and look elsewhere.
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Leftie [sic] seems to be your favourite snarl word of choice for whatever it is that you don't like.
Labour have been in power for 32/33 years of the 92 years since they first came to power in 1924. Otherwise it's been a coalition of one sort or another on two occasions (National Government1940-45; Tories and LibDems 2010-15; ten years in total) or the Tories outright.
Perhaps you need to drop the mindless slogans and look elsewhere.
No...and no.
Cameron is a Leftie. It has a particular meaning which is not necessarily the hard left or whatever. It refers to the mind set of the Western world.
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And that's because of multiculturalism and the stupid Leftie project that has swamped this country full of foreign incompatible cultures.
Yup
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A labour voter all my life until the latter days of the Blair / Brown era. By that time I had seen history repeat itself too many times and for a small number of reasons I will never vote labour again.
The lefties and those on the bit further right are mirror images of eachother, but only one despises the British.
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No...and no.
Cameron is a Leftie. It has a particular meaning which is not necessarily the hard left or whatever. It refers to the mind set of the Western world.
Which is what exactly?
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Which is what exactly?
It is all this political correctness which we even see in the US. What was the centre ground in the 80's is now on the right and what was on the left is now centre ground. It is a reasonable idea gone mad; and used by the elites and ruling classes to control the mindset and dialogue of the masses.
We see the ultimate sickness of it in the Rotherham police who were more concerned about not being called racists than helping under aged teenagers and kids who were being sadistically raped by some Pakis. There are eleven forces being investigated for similar dereliction of duty and concern. We also see this in the students who almost went off crying like little children when Germaine Greer aired a point of view that clashed with theirs and called for her talk to be band, instead of debating against her viewpoint as responsible adults.
We only see some semblance of common-sense and level headedness, and strong vociferousness, against this kind of madness from people on the right in the Conservatives; not Cameron and those in the centre of that party, and UKIP. But when they do this they are accused as being racists etc., using all the techniques those Leftie peoples have learnt to try to close down the debate. There are intelligent people on the left now who are also waking up to the insidiousness of what has been going on and are looking to correct thing.