Religion and Ethics Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Steve H on October 05, 2018, 05:57:06 PM
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...so when are we going to get a pope George Ringo?
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When Rome rejoins the true church.
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When Rome rejoins the true church.
And the true church is?
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And the true church is?
Since HWB has posted many times about being Orthodox, what do you think he means?
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Since HWB has posted many times about being Orthodox, what do you think he means?
I was being sarcastic, as there is no 'true' church, imo! ::)
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I was being sarcastic, as there is no 'true' church, imo! ::)
But there is in HWB's opinion. Since you know that and since he knows you don't believe in it, what did your post add? Btw can you address the questions on the Searching for God thread about whether your post about wanting to lock up a possible child rapist is on the wrong thread
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But there is in HWB's opinion. Since you know that and since he knows you don't believe in it, what did your post add? Btw can you address the questions on the Searching for God thread about whether your post about wanting to lock up a possible child rapist is on the wrong thread
Blimey you are certainly getting your kicks today by criticising most of my posts. I will be shutting down my computer for the night in a few minutes so you will have to get your fun elsewhere.
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Blimey you are certainly getting your kicks today by criticising most of my posts. I will be shutting down my computer for the night in a few minutes so you will have to get your fun elsewhere.
Night Night, Mary Ellen.
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Blimey you are certainly getting your kicks today by criticising most of my posts. I will be shutting down my computer for the night in a few minutes so you will have to get your fun elsewhere.
Be a bit forgiving L R, I think he's on his way through the menopause at the moment.
Sorry Rhiannon, I didn't mean this as a sexist dig at you, or women in general, no offence intended toward you, N S will be able to cope I'm sure.
Regards ippy
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I was being sarcastic, as there is no 'true' church, imo! ::)
There is, you know.
All who confess Christ are part of it.
None of us are perfect, no denomination is perfect either.
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There is, you know.
All who confess Christ are part of it.
None of us are perfect, no denomination is perfect either.
Hmmmmmmmmmmmm!
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Hmmmmmmmmmmmm!
Eh?
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When Rome rejoins the true church.
FTR The Orthodox consider the first Pope to have been Leo IX, responsible for the Great Schism (You never know, you might be asked that in a pub quiz)
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I wonder if the real Jesus, rather than the storybook version, would be gobsmacked if he had realised all the things that would be said and done in his name in the centuries after his death?
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FTR The Orthodox consider the first Pope to have been Leo IX, responsible for the Great Schism (You never know, you might be asked that in a pub quiz)
Problem there is that there is no one Orthodox church, nor one patriarch....there are several 'popes'.....not just the two ones living in Rome.
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Problem there is that there is no one Orthodox church, nor one patriarch....there are several 'popes'.....not just the two ones living in Rome.
Yep, the Coptic Pope now comes to mind.
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Yep, the Coptic Pope now comes to mind.
I met him many years ago.
Nice chap.
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Problem there is that there is no one Orthodox church, nor one patriarch....there are several 'popes'.....not just the two ones living in Rome.
There a has alway been many patriarchs. So what? It's no argument one way or the other.
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There a has alway been many patriarchs. So what? It's no argument one way or the other.
Actually, it is. Both the Ethiopian Orthodox Church and the Coptic Church - the latter, of course, predates even the construction of Constantinople, claim to be the true church...anong with that of Greece. Now the split-off from the Russian Orthodox claims to be more true to Orthodoxy than the Russian one....There ain't no 'true church', just the One Church - as per the Scripture.
We all get it wrong, but, hey, that's fine: God loves and forgives us.
PTL.
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Actually, it is. Both the Ethiopian Orthodox Church and the Coptic Church - the latter, of course, predates even the construction of Constantinople, claim to be the true church...anong with that of Greece. Now the split-off from the Russian Orthodox claims to be more true to Orthodoxy than the Russian one....There ain't no 'true church', just the One Church - as per the Scripture.
We all get it wrong, but, hey, that's fine: God loves and forgives us.
PTL.
Wrong again. The Church is visible. And as a protestant you can't use the above as an argument? How many protestant churches are there nowadsys?
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Wrong again. The Church is visible. And as a protestant you can't use the above as an argument? How many protestant churches are there nowadsys?
I don'y argue from 'protestantism'; ad-o; I argue from Scripture. Now, if you want to argue with the Lord Jesus Christ, feel free to take it up with Him! Remember what He told the disciples who moaned that others who were not part of His circle were doing things in His name? And remember what Paul wrote in Colossians? He (Paul) also wrote about the same thing in Corinth - twice. Oh, and Luke had a few things to say about it in Acts. Now, I know you base your church on tradition....trouble with tradition is that it accumulates stuff, like fluff under the bed. Scripture, however, is unchanged.
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I don'y argue from 'protestantism'; ad-o; I argue from Scripture. Now, if you want to argue with the Lord Jesus Christ, feel free to take it up with Him! Remember what He told the disciples who moaned that others who were not part of His circle were doing things in His name? And remember what Paul wrote in Colossians? He (Paul) also wrote about the same thing in Corinth - twice. Oh, and Luke had a few things to say about it in Acts. Now, I know you base your church on tradition....trouble with tradition is that it accumulates stuff, like fluff under the bed. Scripture, however, is unchanged.
Bald men fighting over a comb.
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And remember what Paul wrote in Colossians?
Yes:
“The Ukraine girls really knock me out. They leave the West behind. And Moscow girls make me sing and shout. The Georgia’s always on my mi mi mi mind.”
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Yes:
“The Ukraine girls really knock me out. They leave the West behind. And Moscow girls make me sing and shout. The Georgia’s always on my mi mi mi mind.”
"Yellow matter custard
dripping from a dead dog's eye...."
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"Yellow matter custard
dripping from a dead dog's eye...."
That was John.
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That was John.
Coincindentally, John (not that one)
Wrote that Christ prayed in Gethsemene
"I pray for My people, that they might be one."
I don't recall Christ saying
".....as long as a shower of theologians and politicians are the ones who say what 'one' is...."
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Coincindentally, John (not that one)
Wrote that Christ prayed in Gethsemene
"I pray for My people, that they might be one."
I don't recall Christ saying
".....as long as a shower of theologians and politicians are the ones who say what 'one' is...."
And which 'John' would that be exactly - as historians are completely unclear as to the author.
At least Paul is still alive to attest that John wrote 'yellow matter custard' - this, well ... not so much.
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And which 'John' would that be exactly - as historians are completely unclear as to the author.
At least Paul is still alive to attest that John wrote 'yellow matter custard' - this, well ... not so much.
Who wrote it doesn't matter.
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Wot Steve H said. Though I don't see any reason to doubt that the writer of 1 & 2 John was not the same one as the writer of the Gospel. There might be a case for 3 John, but I'm not convinced that this, too did not come from the same source. Since the 1 John and the Gospel are very close stylistically,and quotes from both survive from around AD 90, I have no problem that they were either written by, or dictaded by, the disciple John, brother of James.
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Who wrote it doesn't matter.
Of course it matters - without knowing the author it is impossible to ascertain the context and the level of bias in what he wrote. It also becomes very difficult to understand the trail to actual events, noting that most likely dates are some 60-80 years after Jesus' death.
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... I have no problem that they were either written by, or dictaded by, the disciple John, brother of James.
Hand waving assertions. You might want that to be true as it fits with your beliefs, but you don't have evidence that it it is true.
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Hand waving assertions. You might want that to be true as it fits with your beliefs, but you don't have evidence that it it is true.
Nor is their evidence to the contrary.
By the way, since quotes from both the first letter and Gospel exist in other writings around 90 AD, they must both have been in circulation before then, making the time between thwe events of both shorter than eighty years.
I'd say fifty-ish for the Gospel, probably 20-30 for the letter.
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Nor is their evidence to the contrary.
You are the one making assertions as to authorships, therefore the onus on providing evidence to support that assertion rests entirely with you.
By the way, since quotes from both the first letter and Gospel exist in other writings around 90 AD, they must both have been in circulation before then, making the time between thwe events of both shorter than eighty years.
I'd say fifty-ish for the Gospel, probably 20-30 for the letter.
More un-evidenced assertions. Most historians date both to approx 90-110.
But even if your 20-30 years were correct (you have no evidence for this) then that is still, literally, decades after the events. Who knows what level of misinterpretation, exaggeration, spin may have been added across even that more limited timespan.
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By the way, since quotes from both the first letter and Gospel exist in other writings around 90 AD, they must both have been in circulation before then,
Could you elaborate as to which writings you you are talking about. I've not heard of any quotes from that early before.