Richard Dawkins unwell

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Genuinely sorry to hear Richard Dawkins is unwell (stroke I believe).

[Shaker]

Yes but a minor one, and he's expected to make a full recovery. Recuperating at home in Oxford, I gather.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Yes but a minor one, and he's expected to make a full recovery. Recuperating at home in Oxford, I gather.

Good, these things can be touch and go.

[Sriram]

The Church of England has prayed for him I understand.  Some controversy has been racked up about that I think.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-35571588

*************
The Church of England has defended a tweet it sent praying for secularist Richard Dawkins after he had a stroke.

The Church tweeted on Friday "Prayers for Prof Dawkins and his family" after the author fell ill on 5 February.

It was retweeted more than 1,000 times and led some to question if it was mocking the British atheist's position.

But the Church's communications director defended the comment, saying it was a "genuine tweet offering prayer for a public person who was unwell".

*************

Nothing wrong with praying for someone, even an atheist!

[Hope]

Yes but a minor one, and he's expected to make a full recovery. Recuperating at home in Oxford, I gather.

Minor or not, and only partially depending on which side of the brain it occurred, strokes aren't a joke.  I can sympathise with him and the family. 

I was glad to hear that the CofE have asked people to pray for him.

[SusanDoris]

Minor or not, and only partially depending on which side of the brain it occurred, strokes aren't a joke.  I can sympathise with him and the family. 

I was glad to hear that the CofE have asked people to pray for him.

Why? What good can it possibly do for RD? Do you seriously think there is some God who will pay attention to those prayers and then do something to improve his condition? Should he rely on some imaginary god to help him regain  fitness, or is it better to rely on 300 mg soluble aspirin, correct pills for blood pressure, exercises
advised by physiotherapists, support from Stroke experts, etc etc.
 And I suppose I might just as well delete all that, but I have decided not to!

[Hope]

Why? What good can it possibly do for RD? Do you seriously think there is some God who will pay attention to those prayers and then do something to improve his condition? Should he rely on some imaginary god to help him regain  fitness, or is it better to rely on 300 mg soluble aspirin, correct pills for blood pressure, exercises
advised by physiotherapists, support from Stroke experts, etc etc.
 And I suppose I might just as well delete all that, but I have decided not to!

You are quite entitled to your opinion, Susan, in the same way as I am.  Not only do I believe that 'there is some God who will pay attention to those prayers and then do something to improve his condition', as a result of experience - my own and that of others - but we all know that RD is adamantly anti-Christian and CofE especially, so I'd call this graciousness on behalf of the Church hierarchy.

Having suffered my own stroke 3.5 months ago, I wouldn't suggest that its an either ... or situation, which you seem to think it is.

[Shaker]

... we all know that RD is adamantly anti-Christian and CofE especially, so I'd call this graciousness on behalf of the Church hierarchy.

The point about RD being especially hostile to the C of E isn't actually true. On a number of occasions he's spoken of an appreciation for, sometimes even a fondness for, various elements of the C of E - some hymns, ecclesiastical buildings, etc.

http://goo.gl/LXp7Fw

[Hope]

The point about RD being especially hostile to the C of E isn't actually true. On a number of occasions he's spoken of an appreciation for, sometimes even a fondness for, various elements of the C of E - some hymns, ecclesiastical buildings, etc.

Sorry, I've heard him excoriate the CofE in debates and presentations.  Just because he speaks of an appreciation of certain elements of the CofE - such as hymns and buildings (none of which are uniquely CofE) doesn't mean he doesn't dislike the organisation.

[Shaker]

He probably does dislike the organisation for as much as I know - plenty of Christians and Anglicans included do; I was refuting your assertion that he is "adamantly anti-Christian and CofE especially," which is patently untrue. You can find out more by reading the link to the Spectator interview I provided.

[Hope]

He probably does dislike the organisation for as much as I know - plenty of Christians and Anglicans included do; I was refuting your assertion that he is "adamantly anti-Christian and CofE especially," which is patently untrue. You can find out more by reading the link to the Spectator interview I provided.

The Spectator interview is all very well, but when he excoriates an organisation in live interviews, one has to accept that opinion too.

[SusanDoris]

The Spectator interview is all very well, but when he excoriates an organisation in live interviews, one has to accept that opinion too.

Can you quote the actual words he used when he, as you put it, 'excoriates' an organisation?I shall not be surprised if your word is very much of an exaggeration.

[Leonard James]

You are quite entitled to your opinion, Susan, in the same way as I am.  Not only do I believe that 'there is some God who will pay attention to those prayers and then do something to improve his condition', as a result of experience - my own and that of others - but we all know that RD is adamantly anti-Christian and CofE especially, so I'd call this graciousness on behalf of the Church hierarchy.

Having suffered my own stroke 3.5 months ago, I wouldn't suggest that its an either ... or situation, which you seem to think it is.

To believe that "God" was in any way the cause of your recovery you must ask yourself what is so special about you and non-special about all those that pray for recovery but die.

Stop kidding yourself.

[Hope]

To believe that "God" was in any way the cause of your recovery you must ask yourself what is so special about you and non-special about all those that pray for recovery but die.

Stop kidding yourself.

As I said, I don't place my recovery - which is on-going - purely at the feet of medical science or of God.  So, that bit of your argument is moot.  As for what is so special about me - nothing: that's the point.  God wants the best for humanity, not just certain members of the species.  His wishes are sometimes thwarted by human actions, and sometimes prayers for healing are more exercises in avoiding reality than actually wanting healing.

[Aruntraveller]

I would think that Mr Dawkins is very unlikely to be upset by prayers offered up for him and probably greets them with a wry smile and with thanks that people are thinking of him.

On the rare occasions when people have done that for me - that is how I have reacted (I may be projecting - but the man does have a sense of humour). I don't think it's worth getting upset about a type of behaviour that is intended to do good and is offered in a well meaning fashion even if it doesn't achieve anything.

[Leonard James]

As I said, I don't place my recovery - which is on-going - purely at the feet of medical science or of God.  So, that bit of your argument is moot.  As for what is so special about me - nothing: that's the point.  God wants the best for humanity, not just certain members of the species.  His wishes are sometimes thwarted by human actions, and sometimes prayers for healing are more exercises in avoiding reality than actually wanting healing.

That's your usual evasion of the question. Despicably suggesting that some of the people who pray are not "actually wanting healing", is a new low.

[Shaker]

I would think that Mr Dawkins is very unlikely to be upset by prayers offered up for him and probably greets them with a wry smile and with thanks that people are thinking of him.

On the rare occasions when people have done that for me - that is how I have reacted (I may be projecting - but the man does have a sense of humour). I don't think it's worth getting upset about a type of behaviour that is intended to do good and is offered in a well meaning fashion even if it doesn't achieve anything.

That's the way Hitch treated it when he was ill - in a "At least they mean well (mostly ... usually)" sense.

[Aruntraveller]

That's your usual evasion of the question. Despicably suggesting that some of the people who pray are not "actually wanting healing", is a new low.

That thought had occurred to me as well Len. There is a certain amount of pride suggested that I find most unappetizing.

[Bubbles]

Why? What good can it possibly do for RD? Do you seriously think there is some God who will pay attention to those prayers and then do something to improve his condition? Should he rely on some imaginary god to help him regain  fitness, or is it better to rely on 300 mg soluble aspirin, correct pills for blood pressure, exercises
advised by physiotherapists, support from Stroke experts, etc etc.
 And I suppose I might just as well delete all that, but I have decided not to!

What good does a card do?
Or flowers?
It's a sort of " well wishing"

🌹

 

[Bubbles]

I hope he makes a full recovery.
I might criticise him but the whole debate would be less without him.


🌹

[Walt Zingmatilder]

What good does a card do?
Or flowers?
It's a sort of " well wishing"

🌹

 

Thanks Rose

The voice of reason.

[Gonnagle]

Dear Vlad,

Radio 2, just now, lovely atheist lady being asked about prayers, she some how got the subject on to evolution

Gonnagle.

[Walt Zingmatilder]

Dear Vlad,

Radio 2, just now, lovely atheist lady being asked about prayers, she some how got the subject on to evolution

Gonnagle.

keep listening Mr G she,ll soon be onto the inquisition .

[Hope]

That's your usual evasion of the question. Despicably suggesting that some of the people who pray are not "actually wanting healing", is a new low.

Such a new low that it has been known within the church for years.  It is one of the things that is included in training people to pray for healing.  There are those who pray for the healing of a relative or friend not because they primarily want the person healed, but because their prime concern is that they won't be left without the support that the other person has provided them for however many years it might have been.  I suppose that's the problem about not believing that people can be healed - one doesn't appreciate the various nuances of reasons for prayer.

[Hope]

That's your usual evasion of the question. Despicably suggesting that some of the people who pray are not "actually wanting healing", is a new low.

If its my 'usual evasion of the question', it can't be a new low