Author Topic: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.  (Read 36094 times)

Brownie

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #75 on: May 15, 2016, 10:18:10 AM »
I have an open mind about moon landings too floo.
Morning Sassy.  Please come over to the R&E section and have a gander at the thread, 'A very disturbing story',  the medical stuff Sririam has posted particularly (& me, been feeling rough for a few days but on the mend now).  I'd be interested to know what you think about the alternative medicine discussed.

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floo

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #76 on: May 15, 2016, 10:20:45 AM »
If they were a con, it wouldn't be able to be kept under wraps and only in the mind of conspiracy theorists!

Brownie

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #77 on: May 15, 2016, 10:29:39 AM »
If they were a con, it wouldn't be able to be kept under wraps and only in the mind of conspiracy theorists!

It isn't really kept under wraps, floo, there is plenty of evidence for and against.  I am just open minded.

Looks like Sass has gone off for a while, she won't have seen my last post.  Never mind, maybe later.
« Last Edit: May 15, 2016, 10:32:18 AM by Brownie »
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Sassy

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #78 on: May 15, 2016, 10:31:18 AM »
Watch this:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lltT1wPZDkc


The maker of the film gagged why if nothing to hide.
« Last Edit: May 15, 2016, 10:37:07 AM by Sassy »
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Brownie

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #79 on: May 15, 2016, 10:33:04 AM »
Oh there you are!  Good.
I'll watch the clip.
Yes, saw it, also listened to an Alex Jones broadcast of Stanley Kubrick's daughter talking about free speech (amazing, I got sound at last. My old man must have fixed it).
« Last Edit: May 15, 2016, 10:40:13 AM by Brownie »
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Stranger

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Sebastian Toe

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #81 on: May 15, 2016, 10:49:02 AM »


Today, I would have no problem believing they landed on the moon.


Today, well a few years ago, there was a mission to photograph the moon's surface. Guess what detail was picked up?

Apollo 11

http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/14

Apollo 11 flip-book.
http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/1

Drag the yellow button on the slide above the photograph to see a time-lapse where it can clearly be seen with shadows depending on the angle of the sun when the photographs were taken.

Do the same for the rest of the missions.

Apollo 12

http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/2

Apollo 14
http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/3

Apollo 15
http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/4

Apollo 16
http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/5

Apollo 17
http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/6

Any opinion on those?




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Stranger

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #82 on: May 15, 2016, 10:56:45 AM »
It isn't really kept under wraps, floo, there is plenty of evidence for and against.

No, there isn't. The fake moon landings is daft conspiracy theory.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-35411684

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6MOnehCOUw
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Walt Zingmatilder

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #83 on: May 15, 2016, 11:00:16 AM »
Today, well a few years ago, there was a mission to photograph the moon's surface. Guess what detail was picked up?

Apollo 11

http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/14

Apollo 11 flip-book.
http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/1

Drag the yellow button on the slide above the photograph to see a time-lapse where it can clearly be seen with shadows depending on the angle of the sun when the photographs were taken.

Do the same for the rest of the missions.

Apollo 12

http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/2

Apollo 14
http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/3

Apollo 15
http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/4

Apollo 16
http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/5

Apollo 17
http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/6

Any opinion on those?
Yep, you need to get out more.
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bluehillside Retd.

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #84 on: May 15, 2016, 11:01:23 AM »
Seb,

Quote
Today, well a few years ago, there was a mission to photograph the moon's surface. Guess what detail was picked up?

Apollo 11

http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/14

Apollo 11 flip-book.
http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/1

Drag the yellow button on the slide above the photograph to see a time-lapse where it can clearly be seen with shadows depending on the angle of the sun when the photographs were taken.

Do the same for the rest of the missions.

Apollo 12

http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/2

Apollo 14
http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/3

Apollo 15
http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/4

Apollo 16
http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/5

Apollo 17
http://www.lroc.asu.edu/featured_sites/view_site/6

Any opinion on those?

Fakes! All of them!

See what they did was just fake the Apollo 11 landing as Sassy says, then - and here's the clever bit - a week after that they sent a real rocket to the moon for a manned landing, ONLY IN SECRET and they put all that stuff there!

I know, I know - brilliant isn't it. Of course it's all been covered up by the CIA, the Yosemite Park Rangers and - er - the Boy Scouts, but there it is. Truth will out eventually!

Oh hang on - me tinfoil hat's fallen off and there's someone banging on the front door...


...AAAARRRRGGGGHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Last Edit: May 15, 2016, 11:05:38 AM by bluehillside »
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Brownie

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #85 on: May 15, 2016, 11:06:31 AM »
I don't know why people cannot at least be open minded about it. It's quite possible the moon landings were faked.  We don't know for sure but having some scepticism doesn't make a person a loony conspiracy theorist (not that anyone has used those words except me).
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Sassy

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #86 on: May 15, 2016, 11:20:19 AM »
If using the same faked sites then they can show what they want...

Why did the real footage and most of the photographs and of course the moon rock disappear in the 1980's.

We know that no COUNTRY who had all that important documentation would lose it... Would they?
The USA government cannot keep their most precious information safe...

We know we have to work together to abolish war and terrorism to create a compassionate  world in which Justice and peace prevail. Love ;D   Einstein
 "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

bluehillside Retd.

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #87 on: May 15, 2016, 12:10:20 PM »
Brownie,

Quote
I don't know why people cannot at least be open minded about it. It's quite possible the moon landings were faked.  We don't know for sure but having some scepticism doesn't make a person a loony conspiracy theorist (not that anyone has used those words except me).

Yes it does, and here's why:

First, the moon landings were a fantastically complicated enterprise involving tens and possibly hundreds of thousands of personnel, both in NASA and in the myriad contractors from whom they bought components specified and made for the task. In strict epistomological terms it's not impossible that every single one of them kept schtumm in the ensuing decades, but it's so vanishingly unlikely as to be not worth bothering with.

Second, those who cry "fake" have had their arguments systematically dismantled many times. There is no evidence that contradicts the fact of the landings (I'm using "evidence" in the real sense here, rather than in Hope's "if it confirms my biases then its evidence" sense by the way). Every bit of the "if there's no wind on the moon how come the flag stuck out?" -type stupidities that Sassy and others have attempted have been thoroughly rebutted.

Third, I would remind you that this is the same Sassy who assured us that only some planets have gravity so you're dealing here with someone whose grip on reality is - to put it charitably - tenuous, and entirely assertion-based.

The good news though is that it's kept Bacofoil in business for years, what with all those tinfoil hats they need to stop aliens reading their minds while they type away in their dressing gowns.
« Last Edit: May 15, 2016, 12:27:54 PM by bluehillside »
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Gordon

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #88 on: May 15, 2016, 08:18:27 PM »
Moderator:

This thread has been created retrospectively to hold posts about different views of the Moon landings (and related matters) that were split off from a thread about evidence for theism.

Lunar enthusiasts now have this thread to continue the 'fact vs fiction' discussion.

Maeght

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #89 on: May 15, 2016, 08:49:11 PM »
The first lunar model and suits had no protecting against the Van Allen belt.
The truth is that it would NOT KILL INSTANTLY but the overall affect means they would die some time after returning.
The problem is that there are many physicist today who believe that man never went to the moon and all equally qualified as those at Nasa.

I repeat my earlier post: There have been measurements made, as I said, of the leveles of radiation to which astronauts were exposed and they were well below fatal levels.  The vessel was only within the van Allen Belt for a short period and the hull of the ship did give some protection.

Which scientist are you referring to?

Quote
Again we have to decided on evidence as a whole. How did the moon rocks come to have numbers on them?

They didn't.

Quote
How did Neil Armstrongs boots leave a different footprint to the boot he actually wore?

What evidence do you have for that?

Quote
Today, I would have no problem believing they landed on the moon. But in 1969 I do not believe they could have done.
Nor do I believe they had the protection necessary to do it safely.

Belief not knowledge.

Quote
What is clear they somehow lost precious footage and pictures including the moon rock in the 80's. Who puts material like that in a place it can be wiped or stolen?

Samples of Moon rock are stored in a number of places and are not lost. Pieces of Moon rock were sent to various countries as goodwill gifts and the location of a number of these is unknown. Why would a few disappear but not all if there was some cover up?

Maeght

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #90 on: May 15, 2016, 08:53:22 PM »
I don't know why people cannot at least be open minded about it. It's quite possible the moon landings were faked.  We don't know for sure but having some scepticism doesn't make a person a loony conspiracy theorist (not that anyone has used those words except me).

By open minded do you mean accept all the supposed evidence which has been debunked and shown to be based on misunderstandings and frankly ignorance? It's possible the moon landings were faked but based on a sensible review of all the evidence it is highly unlikely.

Maeght

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #91 on: May 15, 2016, 10:25:28 PM »

The truth is that it would NOT KILL INSTANTLY but the overall affect means they would die some time after returning.

You previously said 'The suits they had then would not have kept them safe and they would have died from the affect very soon after.' So which is the truth - very soon after or some time after?

Quote
The problem is that there are many physicist today who believe that man never went to the moon and all equally qualified as those at Nasa.

You've been asked to provide citations for this but haven't yet so could you let us know who these many, well qualified physicists are please?


jeremyp

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #92 on: May 17, 2016, 07:44:11 PM »
I don't know why people cannot at least be open minded about it.
Why do I need to consider the alternative to something that is absolutely cast iron guaranteed truth?

Be open minded but not so open minded that your brain falls out.

Quote
It's quite possible the moon landings were faked.

No it isn't. The scale of the conspiracy would be such that it would have leaked by now.
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torridon

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #93 on: May 17, 2016, 08:59:57 PM »
I don't know why people cannot at least be open minded about it. It's quite possible the moon landings were faked.  We don't know for sure but having some scepticism doesn't make a person a loony conspiracy theorist (not that anyone has used those words except me).

Well they either went or they didn't go so I suppose that must make it an evens chance no ?

Also I read on the internet that the British Royal family are shape shifting lizards from outer space; well either they are or they aren't so I guess we'd better keep an open mind on that one too.

Sassy

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #94 on: May 18, 2016, 08:54:43 AM »
Brownie,

Yes it does, and here's why:

First, the moon landings were a fantastically complicated enterprise involving tens and possibly hundreds of thousands of personnel, both in NASA and in the myriad contractors from whom they bought components specified and made for the task. In strict epistomological terms it's not impossible that every single one of them kept schtumm in the ensuing decades, but it's so vanishingly unlikely as to be not worth bothering with.

Personnel, who were concealed withing buildings and whom would not know if something filtered in to the studio.
So it isn't impossible. The Astronauts who trained for the first moon landing who were not selected all died in mysterious circumstances. One or two may have accidents but not the whole of those who trained except those who went to the moon.

When this had happened previously to the moon landing mission:-

https://aplanetruth.info/2015/03/31/24-why-did-so-many-apollo-astronots-die-mysterious-deaths-in-just-three-years-time/

Who would have thought it safe to speak out? So all this exposed in 4 years business is not good enough.
Apparently those who could really have exposed it, were murdered it would appear before they could tell anyone.
Given all those deaths and the fact one astronaut said just before he death..."

Quote
But Grissom was also an outspoken critic of the program. Among his last words before he died, when there was a communications failure with the capsule just prior to the fire, were: “How are we going to get to the moon when we can’t communicate between two buildings?”

Moments later, the capsule burst into flames with the astronauts sealed inside. They were consumed by the fire with no chance to escape. His widow Betty and his son Scott both still maintain that the astronauts were killed deliberately by sabotage – and that their many questions have never been adequately answered.

Then Challenger explodes after take off with a teacher on board who won the chance to go into space.
January 1986.
It is weird how people died mysterious deaths but was a good chance to stop members of the public going up.





Quote
Second, those who cry "fake" have had their arguments systematically dismantled many times. There is no evidence that contradicts the fact of the landings (I'm using "evidence" in the real sense here, rather than in Hope's "if it confirms my biases then its evidence" sense by the way). Every bit of the "if there's no wind on the moon how come the flag stuck out?" -type stupidities that Sassy and others have attempted have been thoroughly rebutted.

WRONG:  the arguments have not been dismantled. The examination of the moon rocks would have shown whether from earth now or a different planet but they disappeared suddenly. Even the Russians themselves do not really believe they made it to the moon. The experts who deny it happened are physicists and experts in their particular fields. Plus the Russian Scientist.
Within four years people were already denying the landing on the moon. It did come out.

Quote

Third, I would remind you that this is the same Sassy who assured us that only some planets have gravity so you're dealing here with someone whose grip on reality is - to put it charitably - tenuous, and entirely assertion-based.

The good news though is that it's kept Bacofoil in business for years, what with all those tinfoil hats they need to stop aliens reading their minds while they type away in their dressing gowns.

Oh, so you think that I, Sassy am somehow by 'say so' a force against the landing on the moon. Such a childish and even worrying thought from you.
My belief is based on a few things including Scientist (those with the know how) you and I do not have.
There are other reasons and you have to work them out for yourself.
If man travels for 6 weeks away from the earth what would he really be able to see from that distant?
This was a time when we could not sent images any other way than by camera.

We know we have to work together to abolish war and terrorism to create a compassionate  world in which Justice and peace prevail. Love ;D   Einstein
 "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

BeRational

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #95 on: May 18, 2016, 09:07:11 AM »
Well they either went or they didn't go so I suppose that must make it an evens chance no ?

Also I read on the internet that the British Royal family are shape shifting lizards from outer space; well either they are or they aren't so I guess we'd better keep an open mind on that one too.

Equally, my chance of winning the lottery is also 50/50 right?
I see gullible people, everywhere!

jeremyp

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #96 on: May 18, 2016, 10:17:52 AM »
So it isn't impossible. The Astronauts who trained for the first moon landing who were not selected all died in mysterious circumstances.

No they didn't.

Quote
One or two may have accidents but not the whole of those who trained except those who went to the moon.

When this had happened previously to the moon landing mission:-

https://aplanetruth.info/2015/03/31/24-why-did-so-many-apollo-astronots-die-mysterious-deaths-in-just-three-years-time/

That wasn't a Moon landing mission, it was a ground based test. Also, there was nothing suspicious about it, it was caused by an electrical problem in an oxygen rich environment in a capsule full of inflammables.

Quote
Then Challenger explodes after take off with a teacher on board who won the chance to go into space.
January 1986.

Nothing mysterious about that either.
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Bubbles

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #97 on: May 18, 2016, 10:36:34 AM »
I suppose it's possible it could have been faked but I think it was highly unlikely.


Bubbles

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #98 on: May 18, 2016, 10:47:20 AM »
Personnel, who were concealed withing buildings and whom would not know if something filtered in to the studio.
So it isn't impossible. The Astronauts who trained for the first moon landing who were not selected all died in mysterious circumstances. One or two may have accidents but not the whole of those who trained except those who went to the moon.

When this had happened previously to the moon landing mission:-

https://aplanetruth.info/2015/03/31/24-why-did-so-many-apollo-astronots-die-mysterious-deaths-in-just-three-years-time/

Who would have thought it safe to speak out? So all this exposed in 4 years business is not good enough.
Apparently those who could really have exposed it, were murdered it would appear before they could tell anyone.
Given all those deaths and the fact one astronaut said just before he death..."

Then Challenger explodes after take off with a teacher on board who won the chance to go into space.
January 1986.
It is weird how people died mysterious deaths but was a good chance to stop members of the public going up.





WRONG:  the arguments have not been dismantled. The examination of the moon rocks would have shown whether from earth now or a different planet but they disappeared suddenly. Even the Russians themselves do not really believe they made it to the moon. The experts who deny it happened are physicists and experts in their particular fields. Plus the Russian Scientist.
Within four years people were already denying the landing on the moon. It did come out.

Oh, so you think that I, Sassy am somehow by 'say so' a force against the landing on the moon. Such a childish and even worrying thought from you.
My belief is based on a few things including Scientist (those with the know how) you and I do not have.
There are other reasons and you have to work them out for yourself.
If man travels for 6 weeks away from the earth what would he really be able to see from that distant?
This was a time when we could not sent images any other way than by camera.

The astronauts last words, we don't know the context.

We don't know for sure what the incidence of the two buildings,relates too.

Plus thinking people getting into space are being killed so they don't, is just ridiculous.

Getting up there is just plain dangerous, it's a risk ATM.

I was watching a programme the other day where that chef that owns the fat duck ( and cooks insects and other things) was cooking a menu for Tim whats his name in the space station.

Well his first efforts blew up with the rocket that was dispatched to send his efforts to the space station.

No one was sabotaging his grub, it's just still,  a dangerous place to go.

So many things can go wrong.

The teacher got blown up as have many others, for the same reason the food got blown up, it's dangerous.

The public have probably been stopped because the people in charge know it isn't yet like catching a bus.

When it is, the public will be allowed to go.

I expect they have been stopped as a sort of " duty of care"


P.s.

This is what I saw

http://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2016/mar/20/hestons-dinners-in-space
« Last Edit: May 18, 2016, 10:52:46 AM by Rose »

Gordon

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Re: The Moon Landings: fact vs fiction.
« Reply #99 on: May 18, 2016, 11:18:31 AM »
It is quite ironic that while the Moon landings are falsifiable: there are either man-made artifacts on the Moon or there are not (and it seems that there are) - the likes of Sass contest this via various convoluted conspiracy theories whilst, at the same time, claiming as true the unfalsifiable supernatural claims of some ancient middle-eastern religious anecdotes.

Very odd!