Author Topic: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"  (Read 6924 times)

Brownie

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"I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« on: November 15, 2016, 12:58:01 PM »
I read an article about this singer/musician last night and thought she might appeal to some posters:

http://www.standard.co.uk/goingout/music/madeleine-peyroux-i-want-to-see-the-world-through-an-atheist-lens-a3393511.html



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Gonnagle

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2016, 01:12:43 PM »
Dear Brownie,

Quote
"I want to see the world through an atheist lens"

Me to! But they are a very tight lipped community, any discussion soon turns to us silly theists, how so irrational we all are, trouble is that is a human default position, we all are, atheist and theist, irrational, may be it is a sliding scale, us theists are totally irrational and the atheists are just a wee bit irrational :P :P

Gonnagle.
I will now read posts very carefully and then using the two God given brains cells that I have reply as if I am talking to a two year old, yes that should suffice as a gentle reminder✝️✝️✝️❤️

Nearly Sane

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2016, 01:24:22 PM »
Dear Brownie,

Me to! But they are a very tight lipped community, any discussion soon turns to us silly theists, how so irrational we all are, trouble is that is a human default position, we all are, atheist and theist, irrational, may be it is a sliding scale, us theists are totally irrational and the atheists are just a wee bit irrational :P :P

Gonnagle.

Mmm, generalise much?

Nearly Sane

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2016, 01:29:48 PM »
I read an article about this singer/musician last night and thought she might appeal to some posters:

http://www.standard.co.uk/goingout/music/madeleine-peyroux-i-want-to-see-the-world-through-an-atheist-lens-a3393511.html
I have long admired Madeleine Peyroux from her first album. I have no idea, however, what an atheist lens is on the world. It's not a single view, it is a position on a single proposition, and one that impinges almost not at all on any other position.

Brownie

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2016, 01:56:13 PM »
I suppose she had to precis her thoughts into one sentence for an interview, otherwise they'd have been there all day and more  :D.

I'd never heard of her before reading that article and am glad you have and like her.
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Gonnagle

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2016, 01:57:59 PM »
Dear Sane,

Quote
I have no idea, however, what an atheist lens is on the world. It's not a single view, it is a position on a single proposition, and one that impinges almost not at all on any other position.

Hmmm! So you would say your atheism does not affect any other part of your life?

What about Sunday opening times? If you had kids would you ban them from school assembly if it was mostly religious? What about those fat Bishops that sit in the house of Lords, do you think intelligent designers have any place in science, if your local MP was a born again Christian type would that sway how you voted?

Gonnagle.
I will now read posts very carefully and then using the two God given brains cells that I have reply as if I am talking to a two year old, yes that should suffice as a gentle reminder✝️✝️✝️❤️

Nearly Sane

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2016, 02:05:15 PM »
Dear Sane,

Hmmm! So you would say your atheism does not affect any other part of your life?

What about Sunday opening times? If you had kids would you ban them from school assembly if it was mostly religious? What about those fat Bishops that sit in the house of Lords, do you think intelligent designers have any place in science, if your local MP was a born again Christian type would that sway how you voted?

Gonnagle.
it's not the base thing that affects other things. I believe in secularism, so do many theists so I don't see that it's my atheism that it is the cause. I don't see why bishops should be in the HoL but then since I don't think there should be a HoL, that's not the point. I would care more about the policies of the MP rather than their religious persuasion. Again both of those positions are held by many theists so where does atheism come into it.


Most of the day to day decisions, I make don't involve my atheism. I don't see how it affects how I treat others, I don't see how it affects my morality, and I don't see that theists do much different to that. Look at the person, look at their actions not at some position on one topic.

Gonnagle

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2016, 02:34:09 PM »
Dear Sane,

Fair enough ;) But I suspect that is a Nearly Sane way of looking at the world, one that does you credit, just wondering if any other atheists will step up and say, no it does not affect my political views.

Gonnagle.
I will now read posts very carefully and then using the two God given brains cells that I have reply as if I am talking to a two year old, yes that should suffice as a gentle reminder✝️✝️✝️❤️

Nearly Sane

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #8 on: November 15, 2016, 02:58:28 PM »
Dear Sane,

Fair enough ;) But I suspect that is a Nearly Sane way of looking at the world, one that does you credit, just wondering if any other atheists will step up and say, no it does not affect my political views.

Gonnagle.

There is hardly a political position I can think of that is not held by their and atheists. The only ones would be a theocracy and an antitheist state and even then they seem in some ways a mirror of each other. Theist and atheists voted for Trump, and for Hillary. Theists and atheists voted for Brexit, and for Remain. Theists and atheists voted Yes in the Scottish referendum, and voted No. Theists and atheists voted for the Tories in the UK Election, and for Labour, and for the SNP, and for the Lib Dems, and for UKIP, and for the Greens.

Why do you think that theism\atheism given that had an affect on politics?

Ricky Spanish

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #9 on: November 15, 2016, 03:19:05 PM »
It should read "seeing the world through a natural lens" as opposed to a "supernatural" lens.....
UNDERSTAND - I MAKE OPINIONS. IF YOUR ARGUMENTS MAKE ME QUESTION MY OPINION THEN I WILL CONSIDER THEM.

BeRational

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2016, 03:24:07 PM »
Dear Sane,

Fair enough ;) But I suspect that is a Nearly Sane way of looking at the world, one that does you credit, just wondering if any other atheists will step up and say, no it does not affect my political views.

Gonnagle.

I don't think it affects any position I take on a day to day basis.
I cannot think of any position I have (other then belief in a god) where it ever comes up.

Do you take positions just because you believe in the christian god? I would doubt it really
I see gullible people, everywhere!

Gonnagle

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #11 on: November 15, 2016, 05:12:08 PM »
Dear Farmer, ( you are Farmer, right? )

Quote
It should read "seeing the world through a natural lens" as opposed to a "supernatural" lens.....

Supernatural or Super-Natural.

Quote
“There are only two ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle.”

Gonnagle.
I will now read posts very carefully and then using the two God given brains cells that I have reply as if I am talking to a two year old, yes that should suffice as a gentle reminder✝️✝️✝️❤️

Gonnagle

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2016, 05:16:38 PM »
Dear Berational,

Quote
Do you take positions just because you believe in the christian god? I would doubt it really

Doubt no more, I am more and more inclined towards Mr Corbyn purely for his compassionate politics.

Gonnagle.
I will now read posts very carefully and then using the two God given brains cells that I have reply as if I am talking to a two year old, yes that should suffice as a gentle reminder✝️✝️✝️❤️

Nearly Sane

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #13 on: November 15, 2016, 05:30:36 PM »
Dear Berational,

Doubt no more, I am more and more inclined towards Mr Corbyn purely for his compassionate politics.

Gonnagle.
But he's an at-hate-ist

Walter

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #14 on: November 15, 2016, 06:24:11 PM »
But he's an at-hate-ist

politicians should be screened out if they have religious beliefs .It should be law.

Nearly Sane

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #15 on: November 15, 2016, 07:12:28 PM »
politicians should be screened out if they have religious beliefs .It should be law.
or any irrational views. Makes it easy, no politicians

Walter

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #16 on: November 15, 2016, 08:41:28 PM »
or any irrational views. Makes it easy, no politicians

self serving twats the lot of 'em

BeRational

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #17 on: November 15, 2016, 09:43:46 PM »
Dear Berational,

Doubt no more, I am more and more inclined towards Mr Corbyn purely for his compassionate politics.

Gonnagle.

I also like his moral position on some things so the theist position is not a prerequisite
I see gullible people, everywhere!

Brownie

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #18 on: November 15, 2016, 11:12:58 PM »
I would care more about the policies of the MP rather than their religious persuasion.

Most of the day to day decisions, I make don't involve my atheism. I don't see how it affects how I treat others, I don't see how it affects my morality, and I don't see that theists do much different to that. Look at the person, look at their actions not at some position on one topic.

Commendable NS, I agree.  That's how I felt about Sadiq Khan when he stood for London Mayor.

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jeremyp

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #19 on: November 15, 2016, 11:23:37 PM »
Dear Brownie,

Me to! But they are a very tight lipped community, any discussion soon turns to us silly theists, how so irrational we all are, trouble is that is a human default position, we all are, atheist and theist, irrational, may be it is a sliding scale, us theists are totally irrational and the atheists are just a wee bit irrational :P :P

Gonnagle.

For the most part you do see the World through an atheist lens (if a flat piece of glass that does not distort reality can be described as a lens). We both disbelieve in almost all the gods that are allegedly out there. Neither of us see the world through the Islamic lens or the Buddhist lens of the Hindu lens. I just also don't see the world through the Christian lens.
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jeremyp

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #20 on: November 15, 2016, 11:44:44 PM »
Dear Sane,

Hmmm! So you would say your atheism does not affect any other part of your life?
For me, atheism is a consequence of my world view, not the foundation of it.

Quote
What about Sunday opening times?
I don't think that people should be stopped from doing things if they don't harm other people. I think you would agree a religionist could hold that view. So, if they want to go shopping on Sundays, why not, if they can find a shop that is prepared to open?

On the other hand I am broadly sympathetic to Christian shop workers who do not want to work on Sunday, but in the interests of fairness, if Christians can say they don't want to work on Sundays, Jews should be allowed to claim the same for Saturdays, Muslims for Fridays and anybody of other religions other days.

Quote
If you had kids would you ban them from school assembly if it was mostly religious?

No.

Quote
What about those fat Bishops that sit in the house of Lords,
They are some of the last remaining people in parliament who have no democratic mandate. At a stretch, you can argue that most of the peers are appointed by democratically elected politicians so they have a vague connection to the democratic process (although it could be better), but not the bishops. Is it particularly an atheist thing to want democracy?

Quote
do you think intelligent designers have any place in science

That's anti-scientific, not anti-theistic.

Quote
if your local MP was a born again Christian type would that sway how you voted?
Let's be honest, most of us vote for who we do because of the party they represent. I've voted in a number of general and European elections and I have never tried to find out anything about the representative of the party I chose.
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splashscuba

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #21 on: November 16, 2016, 07:59:10 AM »
Dear Sane,

Hmmm! So you would say your atheism does not affect any other part of your life?
Not really
Quote
What about Sunday opening times?
Some atheists don't want Sunday opening and conversely, some religios do.
Quote
do If you had kids would you ban them from school assembly if it was mostly religious?
I wouldn't particularly care. My child has her own mind.
Quote
What about those fat Bishops that sit in the house of Lords
Some atheists don't want them and conversely, some don't care. Some religios also don't want them (I know at least one Christian who thinks it should be an elected chamber)
Quote
, do you think intelligent designers have any place in science
No, but then lots of religios don't as well. I imagine some atheists wouldn't care.
Quote
, if your local MP was a born again Christian type would that sway how you voted?
Depends what he/she says about their views on policy, otherwise what people believe is their own business.
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Gordon

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #22 on: November 16, 2016, 09:21:15 AM »
Since others have had a go at answering these points I will too.

What about Sunday opening times?

Those of us lucky enough to live in Scotland aren't constrained: there are no Sunday trading restrictions here, and there seem to be no frightened horses roaming the streets. I'm for giving people the freedom to do stuff on a Sunday that they could do without constraint on any other day and that some regard Sunday as 'special', according to their own definition of 'special' of course, isn't binding on the rest of us. Nor do I like the idea of an enforced 'quiet day' for society at large.

Funny how in England and Wales large shops have limited opening on a Sunday: I think they tend to close around 4pm while the churches are free to do their stuff over a much longer period of time throughout Sundays but I've yet to hear organised religions suggest they limit their activities of a Sunday so as to aid peace and quiet for all, and until they do I'll treat their bleating about Sunday shopping as being obvious hypocrisy.

Quote
If you had kids would you ban them from school assembly if it was mostly religious?

We did exactly that by insisting that our kids, especially in primary school (non-denominational) when they are very impressionable and tend to believe what they are taught while they are too young to think critically about abstract matters, didn't participate in any acts of religious observance or be exposed to any proselytising by visiting clerical-types - it transpired that we weren't the only ones, and the school was very accommodating. For example when there were Christian services in the local church to which the school was involved, such as the likes of Easter, they made provision for any children not attending the service, which was fine.

It was less of an issue in secondary school, since RE there was about the nature of religions in societies, politics, history etc and also covered the likes of moral philosophy and politics. I asked my elder grandson earlier, when he dropped in en route to school (he's 14, so 3rd year in a non-denominational secondary) who confirms there are no hymns or prayers and that when the school chaplain holds services attendance is discretionary
 
Quote
What about those fat Bishops that sit in the house of Lords,

I'd just get rid of the HoL: it is anachronistic and undemocratic, and I'd bin the monarchy at the same time. We should be able to implement political governance arrangements that are democratic and where those involved are elected and are subject to routine re-election.
 
Quote
do you think intelligent designers have any place in science,

No: so called 'intelligent design' isn't science.

Quote
if your local MP was a born again Christian type would that sway how you voted?

No: I think that religious affiliation should be a personal matter, and to be fair I've yet to see any local politician I could vote for make an issue of either their religion or religion in a broader sense. My local MP is John Nicolson, whom I voted for, and I have no idea of his religious outlook.     

Maeght

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #23 on: November 16, 2016, 11:00:52 AM »
Dear Sane,

Hmmm! So you would say your atheism does not affect any other part of your life?

What about Sunday opening times? If you had kids would you ban them from school assembly if it was mostly religious? What about those fat Bishops that sit in the house of Lords, do you think intelligent designers have any place in science, if your local MP was a born again Christian type would that sway how you voted?

Gonnagle.

I think the point is that there is no common view on these issues amongst atheistst. The only thing atheists have in common is their lack of belief in God but otherwise there views on life can be very different.

Walter

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Re: "I want to see the world through an atheist lens"
« Reply #24 on: November 16, 2016, 11:56:59 AM »
I think the point is that there is no common view on these issues amongst atheistst. The only thing atheists have in common is their lack of belief in God but otherwise there views on life can be very different.

although I would guess that like me most atheists are very skeptical by nature and are pretty adept at critical thinking.