Author Topic: Rape is a personal crime  (Read 429 times)

Gordon

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13814
Re: Rape is a personal crime
« Reply #25 on: December 04, 2018, 09:37:32 AM »
HH, that's such a powerful honest post. Thank you.

Absolutely: very moving indeed.

Littleroses

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1372
Re: Rape is a personal crime
« Reply #26 on: December 04, 2018, 09:47:29 AM »
Thanks to HH for sharing his story with us.

It is so important to teach children about the facts of life in an age appropriate way when they start asking questions. I learned about sex when I was ten, a girl in my class at school brought the book, 'Lady Chatterly's Lover' with all the salacious bits underlined. My mother was too embarrassed to discuss the topic with my sisters and I! As the eldest girl she left the job of explaining about periods and where babies came from to me, which was very wrong of her.  :o

Our children were able to discuss anything they wished with my husband and I, no topic was off limits.
“The more right you think you are, the more wrong you are likely to be.” RJG

Rhiannon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6582
    • Women's Aid
Re: Rape is a personal crime
« Reply #27 on: December 04, 2018, 10:04:24 AM »
Courageous post, HH, thank you.

bluehillside Retd.

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13055
Re: Rape is a personal crime
« Reply #28 on: December 04, 2018, 10:26:56 AM »
HH,

I'm almost lost for words. With regard to this though: "The memory of this shames me - more than 60 years later", I can only suggest that the 13-year-old you was almost certainly a very different person to the 15-year-old you, let alone to the adult you. That is, the "me" that feels shame now wasn't the "me" you were when you were 13. To a significant extent you're ashamed of someone else, not of yourself. 
“One of the great tragedies of mankind is that morality has been hijacked by religion. So now people assume that religion and morality have a necessary connection. But the basis of morality is really very simple and doesn't require religion at all.”

Arthur C. Clarke

Rhiannon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6582
    • Women's Aid
Re: Rape is a personal crime
« Reply #29 on: December 04, 2018, 10:36:57 AM »
HH,

I'm almost lost for words. With regard to this though: "The memory of this shames me - more than 60 years later", I can only suggest that the 13-year-old you was almost certainly a very different person to the 15-year-old you, let alone to the adult you. That is, the "me" that feels shame now wasn't the "me" you were when you were 13. To a significant extent you're ashamed of someone else, not of yourself.

Well put, Blue. I am a vastly different person now to who I was as a teenager. I feel ashamed sometimes of things I said and did although it was from ignorance not a desire to hurt or worry anyine. But that is actually how we learn in life. Doesn’t seem fair that it has to involve other a lot of the time but there it is.

Harrowby Hall

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3569
Re: Rape is a personal crime
« Reply #30 on: December 04, 2018, 11:03:18 AM »
Thank you all for your kind words.

You are right, Blue, I am not the person I was when I was in my early teens but I do wish I had been a little wiser then.
Does Magna Carta mean nothing to you? Did she die in vain?

bluehillside Retd.

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13055
Re: Rape is a personal crime
« Reply #31 on: December 04, 2018, 11:10:44 AM »
HH,

Quote
Thank you all for your kind words.

You are right, Blue, I am not the person I was when I was in my early teens but I do wish I had been a little wiser then.

We all do that my friend, but by definition you cannot have been as wise at 13 as you are as an adult. That's why we have the word "adult". Whoever that 13-year-old was your shame concerns him, not you.     
“One of the great tragedies of mankind is that morality has been hijacked by religion. So now people assume that religion and morality have a necessary connection. But the basis of morality is really very simple and doesn't require religion at all.”

Arthur C. Clarke

Rhiannon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6582
    • Women's Aid
Re: Rape is a personal crime
« Reply #32 on: December 04, 2018, 11:35:31 AM »
HH,

We all do that my friend, but by definition you cannot have been as wise at 13 as you are as an adult. That's why we have the word "adult". Whoever that 13-year-old was your shame concerns him, not you.   

And when it comes to it we have to look very much at the prevailing culture of the times. It's not so much about excuses, but reasons why things happen.

When I first landed at secondary school a boy started to go around hitting girls up the backside with his bag. It was annoying more than anything. After a while it stopped and we became best mates. Then he came out when we were 15. Is there a connection in there somewhere? Who knows, but the 11 year old him was a different guy from my best mate as a 15 yr old.

Littleroses

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1372
Re: Rape is a personal crime
« Reply #33 on: December 06, 2018, 04:03:48 PM »
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/harvey-weinstein-round-robin-email-leaks-‘i’ve-had-one-hell-of-a-year’/ar-BBQzvkE?ocid=spartandhp


My heart bleeds for him, NOT! It is his victims for whom I have a lot of sympathy.
“The more right you think you are, the more wrong you are likely to be.” RJG

Robbie

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4063
Re: Rape is a personal crime
« Reply #34 on: December 07, 2018, 09:45:57 PM »
HH, look back on your 13 year old self with compassion. You were little more than a child and you knew virtually nothing. We've all done things we wish we hadn't. The fact that you still feel pangs of conscience shows you're basically a decent chap. You make no excuses for your 13 year old self. It's over HH.

The story of your grooming a bit later on and having to testify was very moving, you poor young thing. I'm so sorry it created a barrier between your father and you, he obviously wasn't able to process it which was not unusual years ago when such things were almost unthinkable.

« Last Edit: December 07, 2018, 09:48:15 PM by Robbie »
True Wit is Nature to Advantage drest,
          What oft was Thought, but ne’er so well Exprest

Harrowby Hall

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3569
Re: Rape is a personal crime
« Reply #35 on: December 07, 2018, 10:07:21 PM »
Thank you, Robbie.

My father was something of a bully, anyway. I had already disappointed him by not being interested in football and instead being rather bookish.

What I did not mention was that I was also excluded from school for several months as a consequence of my appearance in court.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2018, 10:11:52 PM by Harrowby Hall »
Does Magna Carta mean nothing to you? Did she die in vain?

Robbie

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4063
Re: Rape is a personal crime
« Reply #36 on: December 07, 2018, 10:23:32 PM »
Was that to protect you, HH? I'd have thought, at 13, your name wouldn't be printed in the newspaper.
True Wit is Nature to Advantage drest,
          What oft was Thought, but ne’er so well Exprest

Gabriella

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6967
Re: Rape is a personal crime
« Reply #37 on: December 07, 2018, 11:22:21 PM »
Thank you, Robbie.

My father was something of a bully, anyway. I had already disappointed him by not being interested in football and instead being rather bookish.

What I did not mention was that I was also excluded from school for several months as a consequence of my appearance in court.
HH - I am close to a young man who did something similar to you when he was 12 but the victim was a lot younger. She told her mother who confronted his parents, who then confronted him. He eventually admitted the truth. His victim appears to have forgiven him and moved on. The young man saw a therapist after he admitted what he did to his parents and was also prescribed some medication and is completely different now from his 12 year old self, and a great father to a little girl.

I wish more had been done to keep you from having to deal with predators and bullies.  Why did they exclude you? Because you were brave enough to speak out in court?
“Forget safety. Live where you fear to live.” Rumi

Harrowby Hall

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3569
Re: Rape is a personal crime
« Reply #38 on: December 08, 2018, 09:18:00 AM »
Was that to protect you, HH? I'd have thought, at 13, your name wouldn't be printed in the newspaper.

No. It was to protect the "good name" of the school. The headmaster - who was a bully and a complete failure as a human being - considered that I was not the kind of person he wanted in his school. He had determined that I must be homosexual and he wanted his school to be seen as a bastion of masculinity. The irony here was that there were at least two members of staff who were clearly homosexual.

He refused to allow biology to be taught because he saw biology as "a girl's subject". Eventually, biology was available but only in the the "C" stream - physics and chemistry would be too difficult for pupils of such frail intellect. Anyone who wanted to do medicine at university had to leave and go to a school in another town. There was a good tennis court at the playing field - but it was never used because tennis was not perceived as a masculine sport.

He practised corporal punishment. He humiliated anyone who caused him annoyance and permitted teachers and prefects to use corporal punishment.

This also related to another thread.
Does Magna Carta mean nothing to you? Did she die in vain?