BBC plunged into 'Rule Britannia' censorship row

[Nearly Sane]

Vitally important


https://www.straitstimes.com/world/europe/bbc-plunged-into-rule-britannia-censorship-row?utm_term=Autofeed&utm_campaign=sttw&utm_medium=social&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1598366587

[Aruntraveller]

Load of distracting bollocks.

Leaving aside the fact that we should get rid of Rule Britannia anyway. There really is nothing sadder than a small country warbling on about how it rules the waves when it hasn't done for many a year. We sound, and in many cases are, a sad backward looking lot, living off the memory of some glorious fictional past that was anything but that.

[Owlswing]

Load of distracting bollocks.

Leaving aside the fact that we should get rid of Rule Britannia anyway. There really is nothing sadder than a small country warbling on about how it rules the waves when it hasn't done for many a year. We sound, and in many cases are, a sad backwards-looking lot, living off the memory of some glorious fictional past that was anything but that.

This has been the case since, at the very least, the entry of the U S to WWII,

[Harrowby Hall]

The contribution of the USA to the war against Germany was marginal. Germany would have been beaten by British and Russian forces without the American contribution. The situation in the Far East was different.

I cannot remember whether or not Rule Britannia was part of Henry Wood's Fantasia on British Sea Songs or whether it was introduced by Malcolm Sargent. But it has been there for a long time and audiences like to sing it. All countries have songs which are used for self-agrandisement.

The Last Night of the Proms is a party. It is a night of fun. What harm is done singing Rule Britannia, Land of Hope and Glory and You'll Never Walk Alone?

As it happens, Land of Hope and Glory was not written by Edward Elgar. He wrote Pomp and Circumstance March No 1 in D. Someone else hi-jacked Elgar's sinuous melody and imposed a nationalistic value upon it. Elgar's title actually comes from the the darkest and most despairing moment of Othello.

[Nearly Sane]

Ffs!

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8662651/amp/BBC-Songs-Praise-producer-compares-Rule-Britannia-Nazis-singing-gas-chambers.html?__twitter_impression=true

[Anchorman]

Load of distracting bollocks.

Leaving aside the fact that we should get rid of Rule Britannia anyway. There really is nothing sadder than a small country warbling on about how it rules the waves when it hasn't done for many a year. We sound, and in many cases are, a sad backward looking lot, living off the memory of some glorious fictional past that was anything but that.

   



As far as what's left of my brain recalls, "Rule Britannia" was part of an obscure operetta based on Alfred the Great.  I may be wrong.
But I think the second line of the chorus should be sung "Britannia, rule the waves"...an aspiration, not a statement.
Either way, I agree with TV.

[jeremyp]

Load of distracting bollocks.

Leaving aside the fact that we should get rid of Rule Britannia anyway. There really is nothing sadder than a small country warbling on about how it rules the waves when it hasn't done for many a year. We sound, and in many cases are, a sad backward looking lot, living off the memory of some glorious fictional past that was anything but that.

Nah.

It's just a good song that people like to sing along to at the Last Night of the Proms. And the fact is that Britain did rule the waves for a considerable period and the modern geopolitical situation would almost certainly look very different if it hadn't done.

Having said that, I think they should have cancelled the Last Night of the Proms this year. It's completely pointless without the audience.

[jeremyp]

The contribution of the USA to the war against Germany was marginal. Germany would have been beaten by British and Russian forces without the American contribution.

That couldn't be further from the truth. The USA supplied vast quantities of materiel to both the UK and the USSR and it's quite possible that Germany would have won against Russia without the US supplies.

Without the help of the USA we could not have combatted the U-boat threat and we would have been starved into submission.

If the USSR had survived the German invasion and eventually beaten Germany, the whole of Europe would have been part of Greater Russia.

[Harrowby Hall]

Jeremyp, as someone who has attended the Last Night of Proms on at least four occasions (long, long ago in the time of Malcolm Sargent) I agree with you 100%. It is a party and you can't have a party without people.

I think that the Beeb is running scared. Why, I don't know. The BBC organises the largest music festival in the world largely devoted to European art music (sometimes called "classical"). it features the world's best exponents of that kind of music - orchestras, choirs, conductors, soloists, vocalists - in a substantial part of the genre's repertoire. It provides opportunities to hear music from other genres, too. (Who knows, they may also be considered "classical" in 50 years time.) It has low admission charges and broadcasts every single concert. This is a huge achievement. The BBC should be proud of what it does, not defensive.

The silliest statement that I have heard is that "an orchestral arrangement" of Land of Hope and Glory willbe played. WTF is wrong with Edward Elgar's Pomp and Circustance March No 1?

[Steve H]

The contribution of the USA to the war against Germany was marginal. Germany would have been beaten by British and Russian forces without the American contribution. The situation in the Far East was different.

Britain alone did not stand a chance against Nazi Germany. [Churchill] knew that he needed to bring the Americans into the war...

Antony Beevor, 'The Second World War', Chapter 14.

[Aruntraveller]

Newsthump on Boris's reaction:

Racist man with sordid past somehow unbothered by Britain's racist, sordid past.

[jeremyp]

Jeremyp, as someone who has attended the Last Night of Proms on at least four occasions (long, long ago in the time of Malcolm Sargent) I agree with you 100%. It is a party and you can't have a party without people.

I think that the Beeb is running scared. Why, I don't know. The BBC organises the largest music festival in the world largely devoted to European art music (sometimes called "classical"). it features the world's best exponents of that kind of music - orchestras, choirs, conductors, soloists, vocalists - in a substantial part of the genre's repertoire. It provides opportunities to hear music from other genres, too. (Who knows, they may also be considered "classical" in 50 years time.) It has low admission charges and broadcasts every single concert. This is a huge achievement. The BBC should be proud of what it does, not defensive.

I should clarify: I make a distinction between the Proms generally and the Last Night specifically. I don't see why most of the performances shouldn't go ahead and be broadcast. It's still some of the world's best music and musicians being brought to a wide audience. It's just the Last Night in particular, which is, as you say, a party, that should be cancelled.

The silliest statement that I have heard is that "an orchestral arrangement" of Land of Hope and Glory willbe played.

What are you talking about?!!!!!! It is an orchestral piece...

WTF is wrong with Edward Elgar's Pomp and Circustance March No 1?

...oh, right. As you were.

P&C #1 was played at the 1901 Proms according to Wikipedia, before the lyrics of Land of Hope and Glory were written.

[Aruntraveller]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/aug/25/last-night-proms-land-hope-glory-controversy?

Couldn't have put it better.

[Nearly Sane]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/aug/25/last-night-proms-land-hope-glory-controversy?

Couldn't have put it better.

' Some grey noise from Keir Starmer...' ooft.

[Nearly Sane]

Madness


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